Daniel Frome
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COW Coin
Forum Replies Created
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I expect the list of usual marketing PR talk:
– amazing speed increase due to engine optimizations!
– load projects faster than ever before!
– even better integration with leading compositing tool, Adobe After Effects!
– unparalleled integration with photoshop and other Adobe suite products!
– unprecedented hardware I/O support with leading industry partners!Edit…oh almost forgot the most obvious: Even more amazing speed utilizing cutting edge CUDA acceleration on approved and expensive Nvidia videocards!
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Although I wouldn’t be totally opposed to it… there would be something weird about buying an HP workstation to replace my mac pro… the edit software works the same… but the OS… /shrug
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That’s it folks. Close the debate forum. It has been solved.
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Put my voice in this one Dennis. It’s all about Avid’s trim mode. It’s the reason I keep running back to Avid every time your software laps it in most other facets. No matter how speedy, I want my powerful trim tools at the keyboard level and with per-track controls. Premiere’s trim/roll tools have always been too mousey for 10-hour Monday to Friday level of work.
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“Avid About Premiere”
So did they edit their Pr review in MC 😉 ?Oh Adobe…please make keyboard trimming a reality….
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[Al Bergstein] “Daniel, you really didn’t clarify what kind of recording you are going to do, but it seems like you wanted a boom pole mic, as that’s what the choices you described were about. Do you plan on booming all your work? I don’t think I’d spend that money on using those for shotguns. Would you?”
Hi Al,
The type of shooting I want to do is personal projects, mix of indoors and outdoors (but mostly indoor). Think small scripted scenes with 1 or 2 actors, maybe the occasional corporate job 3-4 times per year.
As for booming with these mics, that’s actually exactly what I was planning on doing. I got the idea after reading some other posts in this forum, specifically noting that some TV shows do exactly this, contrary to (what appears to be) conventional wisdom of needing to lav up actors. The idea is to buy 1 really good mic that I can boom, or hook up to a stand for interviews, etc, and then expand to lavs in the future if I need them. I have a feeling I will usually end up renting extra mics.. but I just want 1 really solid mic to own.[Al Bergstein] “While none of my mics are in the price range you are describing (and that’s wonderful you are considering that price range), I usually hire folks to do the audio when I have to record that quality of work. “
I don’t mind spending a little extra. I’ve had enough experience to know that most mid-to-low range gear rarely lives up to what it promises to do.
[Al Bergstein] “Also, a *first or early buy* would be a field mixer, as virtually all cameras have too much hiss for my tastes. “
I’m actually using a sync box to from my HDP2 and camera, and therefore am only needing a guide track to the camera and sync everything up via timecode in post. I don’t plan on using camera audio, but I know that if I was, this would be good advice.
[Al Bergstein] ” If you are considering being in business as a field audio guy rather than a shooter, that probably is worth the investment. “
I’m actually a TV editor and do not plan on doing audio field production for a job, ever. The fact that I’ve got plenty of post experience is probably the reason I want to buy good quality gear, even for personal stuff.
It’s interesting to note your different opinion on using these mics for boom-work (hopefully the other responders in this forum haven’t been misinterpreted when I say this). I’m glad for people like you sharing your experience and opinion on the matter. Thanks again!
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Interesting find. I’m curious to know more about this as well.
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I’m consolidating our replies here, forgive me:
[Steve Brame] “To be more accurate, this should read “I just feel more creative when cutting in Avid.”
And I don’t doubt that you do, but don’t speak for others. There are a ton of FCP editors (both former and current) who would disagree.”Well Steve, I am also a FCP editor. I edit on all the major NLEs and since I work TV I usually don’t have control over which software I use. I have to like them all. I’m just an editor, as brand-agnostic as they come. I tend to prefer them all depending on what kind of project I have to do. I don’t believe there is one “best” NLE but I won’t back down from telling you which ones [I think] do specific jobs best, and likewise I don’t feel sympathy for editors who stick to one brand and cry foul when it’s not used universally (I’m not pointing that statement at you, but this is leading into the FCPX paragraph of yours…) Before I get to that, I’ll gladly throw in the obligatory “in my opinion” — which can be applied to this entire posting.
Speaking of sticking to one NLE: I think you’re dead on the money:
[Steve Brame] “if an editing platform is to be considered for feature film work, wouldn’t it be better to use one that has had a steady rate of improvement and consistently answers it’s user’s concerns, rather than totally pull the rug out from under the pro user base at a critical time? And yes, I certainly realize that Apple is rebuilding FCP, but tell that to the legions of pros who left and are not going back.”
But remember, even with all that Apple PR about being used on feature films — they had … what? Maybe 3% of the feature film market? They were much stronger in TV by leaps and bounds. I was among those legions who left, But I might come back one day — although it certainly doesn’t look like I’ll need to practice my trackless editing skills for many years to come. Silly Apple. By that time I’ll have my assistants editing off their ipad while they balk at me for ‘still having to press buttons.’ As for feature film work: that world is still dominated by the offline/online edit — which Avid is best at, followed by a distant 2nd with FCP7, and Premiere somewhere lagging behind Edius. In my opinion, of course.
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This doesn’t solve your problem, but I’ll add that about 2 years ago I was in the same boat as you. Our studio was looking to move away from FCP7 and we gave Premiere Pro an honest try. What you’re describing was one of the missing workflow pieces that ultimately led us to go with Avid.
If you find a solution please post it in this forum, as I would be interested to see if a solution finally comes around…
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[Steve Brame] “I’ll be the first to bring up the 500 pound gorilla in the room. “
No, this has been the standard victim card flashed by many people. Not only premiere, but just about every other NLE that doesn’t get the prestige of being used by top-end industry.
I’m not the confrontational type, so please understand that I’m not combating you for the sake of petty forum bashing. I want guys like Benjamin (the original poster of this thread) to know that we’ve tried to implement Premiere Pro into our television pipeline multiple times. While it’s great at some things, it just never makes the cut (no pun intended).
It’s a shame that some FCP editors said bad things about Premiere — because Ppro is obviously a more advanced NLE now. But in order to win over an industry or even just a few studios at time you can’t just be a little bit better: you’ve got to be whopping hand over fist better. Right now Adobe is focussed on making Premiere “more rounded” with better color correction tools, audio tools, etc, but that’s exactly why top-industry doesn’t care: they’ve got tools for that already. If Adobe wants to take over Avid’s space (if they even do, it’s not like it would honestly make them that much more money) then they’ve got to get their editing tools in shape — at least get their ripple tools up to par with FCP7.
What DOES Ppro do well? Anything regarding import and export. They are masters of real-time everything and blazing fast output to any format. Ppro doesn’t a balk at file formats, resolutions, alpha channels, color spaces, it’s a practically perfect in that realm. That’s why it’s used by agencies and corporate projects — where the client is constantly making note after note, export after export — fast in/out pipelines. The middle stage (the ‘editing’ cough cough) is where it’s lacking. And how is it lacking? 1) it doesn’t share projects with multiple computers and deliver collaborative workflow. 2) it doesn’t have enough redundancy in its import/ingest functionality to allow thousands of hours to be ingested by multiple people and not have linking mishaps. 3) it isn’t keyboard friendly enough for actual editing, especially trim, 4) it doesn’t elegantly handle 23.98NDF to 59.94DF delivery pipelines — which is standard for any TV show that shoots 23.98.