Bob Zelin
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COW Coins
Forum Replies Created
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you buy an empty RAID chassis, from OWC, Areca, Highpoint, etc. and put in SSD drives. When you say “ready to go”, do you mean “I am not going to sit there, and read the manual, and try to figure out how to RAID the SSD drives, I just want it READY TO GO, so I don’t have to do anything, except plug it in and start working ”
The answer to your question is nothing.Bob Zelin
Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com -
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no punches – not yet !
There are so many wonderful solutions out there today, and they all work ! For 4K work, you need 10G PCIe cards in PC’s and older Mac Pro’s. Newer Mac’s that have thunderbolt use Tbolt2 to Ethernet adaptors from Promise, Sonnet, Small Tree and ATTO. And you need a 10G switch – most people use Netgear these days because they are so low cost.
Then you choose your shared storage system – and a lot depends on how many drives (how much storage) you need.All the brands you mention are wonderful, and there are plenty of others. What else do you want to know ?
Bob Zelin
Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com -
you can ask me anything that you want. Just email me directly, and I will help you.
Bob Zelin
Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com -
replies below –
I work for a small production company based in Dublin, Ireland. We have 10 members of staff with 5 Edit suites predominantly using FCPX with the potential of expanding to more.
REPLY – remember, no matter what you choose – you need a system that will support NFS network protocol, or you can’t write libraries to the shared volume from FCP-X.
1. Network
After doing a lot of research i’ve concluded (with thanks to the likes of Bob Zelin) that 10GBe CAT6 ethernet is the only way to go. I thought i’d struck upon a hidden gem with thunderbolt networking but turns out the speeds are inconsistent. Fiber (SFP+) is also an option but seems to be more expensive than CAT6. Is my conclusion correct here?
REPLY – you are correct. Fiber SFP+ will be too expensive and too complex for you. And yes, currently Thunderbolt networking does not work. And the Accusys system only supports 3 Thunderbolt clients and you need 5+, so you must use 10GbE.
Other than the switch the main expense for the entire system seems to be the Thunderbolt to 10GBe adaptors to connect the Macs to the network. The best price I can find is either the Sonnet Twin 10G @ £500:
REPLY – the main expense is the RAID array. You must have 8 drives running for a reliable system, so you need a RAID box with 8 drives, and a host card. The Sonnet Twin 10G is excellent, and you can certainly run all your clients without any thunderbolt to 10G adaptor, and still get 100 MB/sec per client – enough for 1080i editing.
https://www.sonnettech.com/product/twin10g.html
https://www.scan.co.uk/products/sonnet-twin-10g-twin-10g-thunderbolt-2-to-d...or the AKiTiO Thunderbolt Adapter @ £450:
https://www.akitio.com/adapters/thunder2-10g-network-adapter
https://www.span.com/product/AKiTiO-Thunderbolt-Adapter-Thunder2-10G-Network...REPLY – the Akitio thunderbolt to 10G will die from heat failure after 8 hours of continuous use. Get the Sonnet.
I have seen a variety of other options from the likes of small tree and sanlink but these seem the most reasonable.
You are correct, but Promise and Small Tree are also both excellent.
Does anyone have any reasons which would be the best Thunderbolt to 10GBe to purchase?
REPLY – Sonnet, but you can run without any adaptors, use native 1GbE and still get 100 MB/sec.
I understand there are also separate enclosures you can buy and add your own card although after doing some research this won’t really save us anything and seems likes more effort. Would you agree?
REPLY – I agree
2. Server
So this is where the world of networking broadens like crazy. I hoping to create a rack mountable system where we can add additional storage later on and RAID’s etc. I’m going to break this section up further to try and make things easier to follow:
a. Hackintosh
b. Mac Mini
c. Mac ProREPLY – I have never done this with a Hackintosh. The Mac Mini is only a single thunderbolt buss, which must run the thunderbolt to 10GbE adaptor AND the RAID array, so it won’t support more than 3 – 4 clients before you get Beach Balls. So you can use a new Mac Pro Cylinder, an old Mac Pro 4,1 or 5,1 with PCIe card, or get a dedicated NAS box.
a. The Hackintosh seems like a very appealing option as we can get great power on a budget. The idea that puts me off this is, being a hackintosh user, i know it requires alot of TLC. Although when setup and the server is working it shouldn’t need any maintenance but for things like updates its troublesome.
REPLY – it’s cheaper to use an old Mac Pro 4,1 which works great, then to build a Hackintosh. And an old 2010 5,1 Mac Pro can run macOS Sierra without issue – I just did it.
b. The Mac Mini I think could be my favorite option as it’s compact and has full apple support. My only worry is if this will be powerful enough to run the Server/RAID etc?
REPLY – bad choice. A new Mac Mini with 16 gig RAM costs as much as a used 2010 5,1 Mac Pro, and the Mac Pro with two x16 lane card slots will dramatically outperform the Mac Mini
One idea that i found that looks great was the High Point NA381TB although have no idea where to purchase this in the UK and Ireland:
https://www.highpoint-tech.com/USA_new/series_NA381TB_overview.htm
REPLY – if you get that RAID chassis, remember, you must buy the Areca ARC-1882ix-24 card as well (hidden expense).
Or something along the lines of the Sonnet xMac mini server:
https://www.sonnettech.com/product/xmacminiserver.html
REPLY – and what will this do for you – hold the Mac Mini ? You still need a host adaptor card. don’t use the Mac Mini.
Does anyone have any incite on these or alternatives? this probably the area i need most help in.
REPLY – yes, you need help. I can help you.
c. We actually own a Mac Pro which could work although don’t think we’d be willing to give it up just to run a server when it’s such a great machine for editing.
REPLY – then use an old Mac Pro.
3. RAID / Storage
What we’re looking for here is something rack expandable starting at around the 64TB mark or maybe larger. We already own a huge amount of 3.5” Seagate 4TB drives that could be repurposed. We’d like a RAID that’s rebuildable in the event of drive failure as the server will now be our only source of DATA and needs to be reliable.
REPLY – then simply buy a large empty RAID array. Remember, if it’s PCIe, you need a host adaptor card.
In this category there are many options but i’ve boiled it down to this particular card- High Point 2760A which looks good and OSX compatible:
https://www.highpoint-tech.com/USA_new/CS-series_rr276x-rr274x.htm
Any other ideas?
REPLY – yes, I have other ideas.
I haven’t done too much research yet on enclosures other than the one mentioned above but seems relatively straightforward. Once I have the correct cards that is compatible with our server.
REPLY – you better do lots of research or hire someone to help you, because it’s easy to make mistakes.
There’s a lot more to mention and speak about but I think this is a good basis to start talking without overwhelming!
REPLY – ask away.
Please ask me as many questions as you need and I really appreciate your thoughts and replies.
bob Zelin
Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com -
this is typical of my BS rant, and it doesn’t mean anything really, but it’s Sunday evening.
You expect to go to the Apple store in the shopping mall, and expect to see AJA and Blackmagic cards, 8 bay RAID arrays, networking equipment, broadcast monitors, etc? Is a shopping mall. It’s a miracle that there is an Apple store in the shopping mall. They sell consumer toys. When you go to an Apple store, do you expect to ask the 25 year old genius “I am looking for the fastest possible renders with Adobe After Effects and Cinema 4D, and possibly Autodesk Smoke – what do you recommend” – are you kidding me. Do you think that even ONE employee in the ENTIRE store has any idea of what these applications are.And lets just say that they did. Let’s just say that MILLIONS of people knew how to use After Effects, Cinema 4D, Davinci Resolve and Autodesk Smoke. Do you think you would have the career that you have now ? Do you think that even the worst FCP-X editor on this forum doesn’t know more than EVERY “Apple Genius” in the Apple store ?
And if I am wrong – well, then we will all be unemployed very soon, and I don’t care how many awards you have.
Bob Zelin
Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com -
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did this answer your questions ? Do you have any more questions ?
Bob
Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com -
Hi Ned –
I paid attention to the thread. today is Sept 26th – the date of your thread. I worked today. I built a new facility today – 4 rooms and shared storage – done all in ONE DAY – so one day labor –one day labor for an entire facility ? So when a young buck edits a show, (and of course, he is better, and more talented then us, and has a better grasp of the new tools) – can he charge LOTS OF MONEY, or does he do it for 200 bucks, because after all, he did it on his laptop with his free copy of Resolve (and it was all h.264, so it fit on his laptop). Please tell me how Mr. Young Buck is going to pay for his medical insurance (what medical insurance) and his house payments (what house payments – he is sharing an apartment with 3 other guys).
But his video looks, great, and already has 75,000 hits !
Bob Zelin
Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com -
Hi –
there are lots of solutions out there. Everyone from AVID, Facilis, GB Labs, Maxx Digital, ProMax, Apace Systems,
QNAP, Small Tree, Synology, Studio Network Solutions, DDP, etc. I was trying to contact you to discuss the details of all of these. Every one of these products will do exactly what you want. They all vary in price, and features (like speed, and amount of storage).Bob Zelin
Bob Zelin
Rescue 1, Inc.
bobzelin@icloud.com