Alex Elkins
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Same here. My solution was to re-wrap to .mov using XDCAM Transfer. Bit of a pain, but at least technically speaking it’s still native.
Alex Elkins
@postbluetv
http://www.postblue.tv
View my new colour correction reel -
I’ll just throw my opinion into the mix regarding audio levels, because as Simon points out, there is no defined standard.
Personally I would prefer to mix to a -10dB peak (averaging -14 to -12dB) same as I’m used to for TV/film. Why? Because I don’t think the uninformed majority should have any say over what the technical specifications should be. However, the reality is that we’re competing with people who just add their favourite song to a cat video without any thought for audio levels. What this means is that people come to view our ‘properly’ mixed audio as too quiet. Therefore I boost the levels by about 6 to 9 dB for web outputs (depending on the general loudness of the content).
Alex Elkins
@postbluetv
http://www.postblue.tv
View my new colour correction reel -
Just an update. The download is now available from here: https://cineform.com/gopro-cineform-decoder
Thought it was worth adding that to this old thread as it still comes up very high in Google.
Alex Elkins
@postbluetv
http://www.postblue.tv
View my new colour correction reel -
[Gareth Randall] “It’s *not* a track destination issue :)”
Had to be sure!
I know you said that a duplicate of the file imports correctly. Have you tried duplicating the file and then re-connecting to it (as opposed to re-importing it and manually repeating all of the cuts you’d done with that clip)?
Another thing to try would be to use FCP’s built-in ‘Make Offline’ feature? I’d use that to disconnect from the problem file, save, close and re-open the project, then manually re-connect to the same file. It might force FCP to kind of ‘refresh’ it’s interpretation of that file.
It’s certainly an odd situation that I’ve never encountered before.
Alex Elkins
@postbluetv
http://www.postblue.tv
View my new colour correction reel -
Perhaps I’m suggesting the obvious here, but I have to be sure…
You do have your track destination set correctly don’t you?
Alex Elkins
@postbluetv
http://www.postblue.tv
View my new colour correction reel -
[Michael Gissing] “FCP will not be the right tool to get broadcast acceptable audio mixes. Seriously I cannot stress the importance of getting a sound professional to finish.”
You’re absolutely right, of course, but what you’re talking about is the ideal scenario. These days there are many occasions where inexperienced editors are thrown into this sort of situation and expected to make things work. Those who get through it unscathed are the ones that go on to be re-hired, so I can see where Richard is coming from. After all, it’s not he who is forcing the budgets down, it’s the broadcasters and producers. So I feel for Richard and others in similar situations. Telling him to hire someone else isn’t much help if he’s not the person in control of how the money is spent, even if we all know full well that it’s the best way to operate.
So Richard, just to reassure you, it can be done. I did it, and have never had a sound mix done inside FCP rejected by a broadcaster. And these are major broadcasters in the UK and worldwide. Yes, learn Soundtrack Pro or whatever, but know that if you have to, you can mix audio to professional standards in FCP. It takes longer, is more cumbersome and the results will never be as good as a professional sound designer using dedicated audio software, but it can be done.
Alex Elkins
Twitter: @postbluetv
http://www.postblue.tv
Post Blue showreel
Latest work: Greyhounds in Motion at 500fps
My Vimeo Pro page -
[Rafael Amador] “the best results comes from hardware conversion, and with the drop of the prices of the Teranex, that shouldn’t be prohibitive option anymore.
“Absolutely right. It’s incredible how cheap the Teranex is now. The problem I’ve found seems to be finding a facility with the newer, cheaper Teranex. At the moment most of the places in London are still on the older technology, so are still charging the old prices.
Alex Elkins
Twitter: @postbluetv
http://www.postblue.tv
Post Blue showreel
Latest work: Greyhounds in Motion at 500fps
My Vimeo Pro page -
Glad I could help.
We don’t have decks here either, we just rent them in as required. To be honest though, it’s not that much more expensive to just take a file on a harddrive to a dubbing facility and let them take care of it for you. Tape dubbing is a pretty technical process and not really the sort of thing that can be easily explained on the internet as there are so many variables, so if you’re completely unfamiliar with it I’d do that. Or even hire an engineer to come to your office to show you how to set it up if you are prepared to make that sort of investment.
It sounds like you are planning to take a file somewhere anyway. Just about every facility you might take it too will accept a ProRes QuickTime file, which if you output it correctly will maintain the 4 audio channels. Maybe post here again when you’re at that stage of the process, but in the meantime the facility you choose to use will be able to offer advice too.All the best.
Alex Elkins
Twitter: @postbluetv
http://www.postblue.tv
Post Blue showreel
Latest work: Greyhounds in Motion at 500fps
My Vimeo Pro page -
In principal I do agree with Michael’s point, but sometimes (usually) budgets force inexperienced editors to have to jump in at the deep end and try to swim. A few years ago I faced exactly the same situation as you, Richard, and the fastest way to learn was to HAVE to get it right. So here, hopefully, is a useful guide for you.
First, you need to understand the difference between audio tracks in your timeline (which you say are all over the place) and mastered audio tracks (or audio channels). Think of A1 and A2 (Channel 1 and Channel 2) as the stereo mix you’re hearing out of your speakers when you play back your timeline – the net result of all of the audio clips in your timeline.
A3 and A4, the M&E Mix (a.k.a. International Mix) will be the same as A1 and A2, only with the voiceover mute, i.e. Music and Effects only. This is so that when the programme is sold to a non-English-speaking country, they can add their own voiceover. Note that you usually include interview and presenter audio in an M&E mix because it would be strange for them to be completely mute, even if they were re-voiced in another language. Tech specs for this scenario vary by broadcaster, but you’d normally want to drop the levels by about 12dB – 15dB to allow for the re-voicing.Here’s how you do it:
1. Tidy up your timeline. I lay mine out like this.
A1: Presenter audio
A2: Interview audio
A3 & A4: Sound effects and any audio recorded in-camera that ISN’T someone speaking
A5, A6, A7, A8: Music
A9 & A10: Voiceover2. Mix your audio
Technical specifications vary by country (and sometimes by broadcaster). Here in the UK we mix to an average level of -14dB to -12dB, with peaks no higher than -10dB. If this side of it is completely new to you then you might want to seek further advice. As a very general guide, you can’t go too far wrong with the following:
– VO, Interview and Presenter audio between -14dB to -12db
– Sound Effects between -20dB to -14dB
– Music at -12dB when there’s no VO, then dipped down to around -19dB when you have VO/interview/presenter audio. This can vary depending on the type of music you’re using. Do what sounds right for each music track.All of this is a guide. Nothing is set in stone and you just have to use common sense. For example, if there’s the sound of gunfire in your mix then it would be suitable for that to peak at -10dB, because it should be loud.
3. Duplicate all of the audio except for the voiceover
– Lasso all of the audio except A9 & A10.
– Hold ‘Alt’, then click and drag the selected audio down so that the copy of A1 is now duplicated onto a new tack, A11.
You should now have 18 audio tracks, where A11 – A18 are exact copies4. Tell FCP to output 4 channels of audio, rather than the 2 you currently have set-up
– Press CMD+0 (or go to Sequence > Settings)
– Click the tab called ‘Audio Outputs’
– On the drop-down menu labelled ‘Outputs’, change it to 45. Route your M&E mix to channels 3&4
If you played back your timeline at any point after step 3 you’ll have noticed that everything (except VO) is twice as loud as it should be. This is because every track in your timeline is still routed to play through channels 1 & 2.
– Right-click somewhere inside the track panel on A11. The track panel is the bit on your timeline where you click to lock and mute tracks.
– You should see a little menu like in the screenshot below:
– Select 3 & 4. If you right-click in the same area again you should see that there is now a little tick next to 3 & 4.
– Repeat this step for avery track that needs to be routed to channels 3 & 4, i.e. tracks A11 – A18 in your timeline, if you’ve followed my track layout.That’s it. When you play back you will find that you can no longer hear the M&E mix over the top of the English mix. This is because you only have two speakers. If you had 4 speakers, and they were set up correctly, you’d of course be monitoring all 4 channels.
Good luck with it. It’s not really as complicated as it sounds. To get a really good sound mix you should, of course, use a professional sound engineer, but there’s no reason why you shouldn’t be able to get pretty good results if you’re comfortable with the technical side of it.
Alex Elkins
Twitter: @postbluetv
http://www.postblue.tv
Post Blue showreel
Latest work: Greyhounds in Motion at 500fps
My Vimeo Pro page -
Rafael’s reply goes to show that all of this is a matter of opinion. The bottom line is that very few people would agree that a software conversion is perfect. Often it’s good enough though.
[Rafael Amador] “Yes, “Frame Blending” is a a problem for Color Correction. If you are, for example, using masks to correct some Secondary, the masks will be spoiled in the blended frames. “
I disagree with this. You’d have to have an incredibly specific mask for it to be ruined by a bit of frame blending within the shot. It’s not ideal, but in my experience it’s never, ever been a cause for concern. Certainly if you had someone doing VFX on the shot there’d be plenty of good reasons to avoid blending frames, but for colour correction it would virtually never be a hinderance, in my opinion.
Alex Elkins
Twitter: @postbluetv
http://www.postblue.tv
Post Blue showreel
Latest work: Greyhounds in Motion at 500fps
My Vimeo Pro page
