Sync slips over time – old 5D footage

[Shane Ross]

Because the footage is 30fps, not 29.97fps. That’s why sync is slipping. The best thing to do would be to conform all the footage to 29.97 in CInema Tools BEFORE you edit…so that it is the right speed.

Shane

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[David Michael]

Thanks for responding Shane, I believe I read a thread were you recommended this some time ago – but it got lost in the noise of all the other recommendations and I’d like to know more. The project I’m working on was given to me as a bit of a mess, but I’m confident there is a way to get this footage to where I want it.

Here would be the workflow (the original h264 files are not currently available, but I will need to reconnect to them after picture lock). I’ve already got prores proxies in 30fps -> cinema tools 29.97 -> media manage an offline with the new sequence settings -> reconnect

Does this sound correct?

Thanks,
David

[Shane Ross]

[David Michael] “(the original h264 files are not currently available, but I will need to reconnect to them after picture lock). I’ve already got prores proxies in 30fps -> cinema tools 29.97 -> media manage an offline with the new sequence settings -> reconnect”

Ugh…that is a mess. You only have the proxies to edit, and you can’t stay in sync. But you need to somehow change the frame rate so that you can sync, edit, THEN relink to the master files? Well, you can’t, because THEY won’t be the frame rate you conformed to at 29.97…they would be 30fps. FCP wouldn’t be able to reconnect…due to the frame rate difference.

My guess is that you’d need to change the audio to match. How? Got me.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
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[David Michael]

Is the issue here that the audio has already been synced with the 30p video? Meaning if I conform those 30p proxies to 2997 then they won’t reconnect either?

You are right about this being a mess.

[Shane Ross]

[David Michael] “Is the issue here that the audio has already been synced with the 30p video? Meaning if I conform those 30p proxies to 2997 then they won’t reconnect either?”

No. Your audio and video at 30fps is losing sync, isnt that what the issue is? The problem will be if you conform the proxie footage that is 30fps to 29.97 to get it to sync with the audio, then you can’t relink to the original 30fps footage.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
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[David Michael]

**EDIT**

I guess I’m missing something here – how is relinking from prores 30p to prores 2997 any different from relinking from prores 2997 to the original h264 (conformed) 2997?

[Momcilo Bozic]

I’d say get the original footage. Change it through mpegstreamclip to 29.97.
Make a new sequence drop in your newly conformed footage. And go re-edit. drop your audio and should be insync.
Copy the reference proxi sequence and paste the old sequence proxi files into that new sequence for an easier re-edit.
Once you satisfied erase all old proxi reference clips from the new sequence

And you shall be done with the edit.
Hope this did not confuse too much.

digital cinematography, montage, directing

[David Michael]

OK so let’s steer this conversation in a new direction now that I’ve been able to test out your conform method to see if that’s even the problem.

I conformed one long clip to 29.97, brought it into the project, fresh. I popped it into a sequence and proceeded to sync the audio. Still terrible sync at the end.

Any other thoughts for the culprit here?

Thanks.

[Shane Ross]

Where did this audio that you are trying to sync to come from? Because conforming 30fps to 29.97 maing it WORSE brings up that question.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

[David Michael]

Well, I can’t say it made it worse – but the slip is so severe it’s hard to tell (seconds not frames).

I’m not sure what kind of audio recorder was used – some fancy thing in one of those blue satchels with the transparent plastic flap would be my educated guess.

On the “audio slate” the recordist claims to be recording at 30 frames/sec (not 2997) 48K 24bit.

It also doesn’t matter whether I use one of the original h264 files that I do have or a prores that I’ve transcoded, the slip is the same, so it isn’t a problem with the conversion.

New thoughts?