Robin S. kurz
Forum Replies Created
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No need to remind him. Already beat him to it long ago. ????
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[Tony West] “I see. You go to your URSA and primes when you want to go to the next level of quality that your phone can’t handle as well.”
Wait… so you’re actually equating things such as Bokeh and/or DOF with quality, with complete disregard for content?! Wow. Because no, that’s certainly not what I was saying, sorry.
It’s never been about a blanket better/worse for anyone, even though that’s clearly what some are trying very hard to spin it to be, to have yet another chance to show how much their superior demands separate them from the riffraff. It’s about an objective when, if and why… and why not. But obviously some feel their “pro-ness” horribly threatened by the mere notion that someone could actually be doing a perfectly good if not great job and making more money than them with such “paltry” tools (not just cameras of course).
But yeah, sorry… they are.
So I’ll also just take that as a “yes” as far as the “Not enough? Unprofessional?” is concerned.
I’m sure that everyone and Bentley, too, were just horrified and furious over the amateurish low-bokeh films they’ve gotten and wish they had sent the filmmakers home quickly!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyYhM0XIIwU
But thank you. I’d say you’ve helped summarize this thread perfectly.
– RK
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[Oliver Peters] “Not every comment is about you.”
Oh, right. Responding directly to me i.e. to something I wrote, quote and all, has nothing to do with me. How totally presumptuous. Got it. Silly me. My bad!
Too bad that that still doesn’t answer a single question either. But I guess that’s e.g. a “no” on seeing “Unsane”. Ok. Hm.
Yeah, Soderbergh has a “good enough” addendum on his production company logo now, too, btw. Since that was clearly HIS whole point as well.
Nothing like a fresh bag of crispy warm logical fallacies in the morning! ????
– RK
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[Tony West] “CBS, NBC, ESPN, these Networks all have camera’s that they consider “acceptable” when they hire for a job.”
Good for them. I just don’t see why that should concern me or any of the 99+% of editors (I’m not a cameraman, but them, too) for whom it’s just as unlikely they’ll ever had anything to do with them. If you do, then sure.
[Tony West] “Believe me, if I could get away with shooting with my phone on most jobs I would do it in a heartbeat. I would love to save the cash.”
Guess what? The clients love it, too, and still getting exactly what they’re looking for. Go figure. ????
[Tony West] “Was the iPhone your primary camera on the job and what type of footage were you shooting with it?”
I’m talking various projects across the board of genres. In one of them the iPhone was in fact the primary, yes. But then, again, I don’t see how that’s really relevant, since the client didn’t care (or even know) either way and had absolutely no complaints as far as the image etc. was concerned. What else should I be caring about? Praise and back-patting from my super-pro peers because I ignorantly snubbed my nose at the notion? ????
[Tony West] “Some of the things I like about my camera are, up to 10 picture profiles stored, SDI out, HDMI out, controls like audio adjustments on the side of the camera, XLR in, four options of peaking in the viewfinder, pre-set A and B WB on the side of the camera. “
Near none of which I personally ever need on a shoot. But if and when I do, I just go with the URSA MP. But mostly because I get ProRes direct off the camera, making my life in post that little bit easier and for the one or other FX plate and the likes.
But without it I still have: Variable Speed Pull Focus, Variable Speed Targeted Zoom, Sync Audio Frame Rate Presets for 24,25, 30, 48, 50 and 60fps, High Speed Frame Rates of anywhere from 60 to 240 fps, 4K, 3K, 2K, 1080, 720 HD or 540 SD, Various Aspect Ratios (2.59:1, 2.35:1, 2.20:1 etc. etc. etc.), can use 3rd Party 35mm adapters, a Moondog Labs Anamorphic Adapter if needed, have Uncompressed or Compressed audio (AIFF, Linear PCM or AAC), Audio metering, Audio Gain Control, Headphone monitoring, Stereo recording support, 100mbps at 4K or 50mbps at 1080p… never mind manual Temperature, Tint, ISO, Shutter Speed, Exposure, BiasFocus etc. etc. etc.
And all of that without a flight case and ZERO assembly required. With me even when I don’t even NEED a camera (or think so beforehand and am proven wrong by some unexpected situation).
Not enough? Unprofessional? Oh well! Surprising how little of a rodent’s backend I could give. ????
[Tony West] “but most of the shots I see with the iPhone don’t have that shallow depth that many want.”
Never ONCE in 20+years of production has a client come to me and said “Make me a film… and be sure to have REALLY SHALLOW DOF!“. And if that were in fact a requirement (even from ME, not them) then, again, I’d go with the URSA MP and my primes (but also not shoot myself). Done. But if I know what I’m doing I can get wonderfully and appropriate low DOF with an iPhone as well (as seen in my other post)!
It’s called “horses for courses”. I at least have the trust and confidence of my clients that I’ll tell the best possible story for them, even if I decided to use an old DV cam. Clearly others don’t and therefore need to hide behind specs and ports and pixels (no, not you). Bummers.
– RK
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[Bill Davis] “How long before this hits video and it’s even harder to tell if it’s a lens or an algorithm?”
How don’t you already have that without any algorithm? These are two random frames from a couple of my iPhone videos (merely scaled by 50%, otherwise untouched and even taken with the built-in camera app for a change, so “sloppy” compared to what is possible otherwise):
… with a nice smooth rack focus here and there. Yeah. The client just HATED it. What a moron for not sending me home quickly!
Would the highlights have been less blown out with my URSA MP (or even with simply more than just available light) and had EVEN LESS DOF (that I don’t even want)? Sure. As well as making getting the same pictures exponentially more of a PITA. So I guess given that, these images are of course crap and totally unacceptable for a “true pro!”, right? … ????????
That elevated mare of certain people is really starting to get very old and hungry.
Whatever. They can continue believing what they want, ignoring objective facts. No skin off my back nor money out of my pocket. Quite the opposite. ????
– RK
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[Oliver Peters] “(Although you could explain what “high-resolution” paint is, since actual paint – oil, latex, etc. as opposed to printing – doesn’t have a resolution, like dpi.)”
????????♂️
Yeah, Oliver, I of course meant it LITERALLY. Everyone knows that’s what a metaphor/analogy is. Bonus points for you also. ????????
[Oliver Peters] “Yes, content is important, but if the delivery and quality are so poor that it takes you out of the experience, then content takes a back seat and the message is lost.”
So you’ve seen what I shot in context and aren’t just throwing a blind, presumptuous blanket of unfounded imputations? And you’ve of course seen e.g. “Unsane” to be the judge of “messages lost”? Of course.
[Oliver Peters] “If you use a tool that you believe is better, then regardless of whether or not it is, your work will benefit accordingly, because of your own headspace at the artist.”
First it’s (essentially) “No way, they suck!“, then it’s “your work will benefit accordingly“… practically in the same sentence. Got it.
[Oliver Peters] “if an iPhone 6S is really equal to an Alexa or 35mm film”
Feel free to actually quote exactly where anyone made that “BS!!1!” claim.
– RK
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[Tony West] “It’s fun to talk about it on a forum like this but on real client jobs it’s irrelevant because they don’t want to see you using it when they are paying significant money.”
Just as I finished shooting a job (3rd) on an iPhone X in 4K with an DJI Osmo 2. The client was ecstatic over the results. Go figure.
I’m not talking theory. To date not single person has complained that anything shot with it anyway looked “cheap” or somehow sub-par. Quite the exact opposite. Either the client trusts your judgment (and the results prove it) or they don’t.
– RK
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[Herb Sevush] “What on earth…”
???? Super bonus points for not getting it the least. Congrats. ????????
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[Herb Sevush] “But would you be just as happy to use the iphones’s built in mic for recording?”
Aside from being a complete straw-grasping non sequitur? Yeah, I’ve used it MANY times and it’s been brilliant. So? Anyone that thinks that’s nuts or laughable, clearly has never actually used it themselves. Or they are just another pompous, self-proclaiming “pro” who is reduced to having to judge the quality of their work by the price tag on a box and random tech-specs. As a cheap distraction from a lack of actual content and ability. Amazingly sad actually.
[Herb Sevush] “With video you are stuck with the built in, cheap, POS lens of the iphone, which is why there is no equivalence between recording audio and video on a smartphone.”
Sure. Whatever you say.
– RK
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