Aaron Star
Forum Replies Created
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I would like to know more details about your laptop hardware. Speccy is a utility that will give the community details about your hardware setup.
Your project settings seem to be ok.
What is the file format of your source material on the lower track? “Media Info” its an application you can get that will tell the community more about the details of your source media.
Super slow rendering of 1920×1080 .mp4 makes me think either the source material format is strange, or the laptop is gimped in some way. The file starting off good then going black makes me also think the source media format is strange.
Have you tried rendering to Sony AVC internet profile, or XDCAM-ex that equals your project settings?
.WMV (VC-1) was a good format back in the day, but there have been a lot of improvements since then. Its generally not a recommended format unless you have a very specific need these days. Stick with Sony AVC .MP4 for a render mode, or render XDCAM-EX.MXF and upload straight to Youtube, ect…
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All of those cards support OpenCL. Vegas uses OpenCL to enhance the calculation speed of the CPU. Certain effects and codecs from the point of decode, to timeline, to encoding can have the math results returned faster by using OpenCL. OpenCL creates a a virtual math co-processor, by combining registers on the CPU with the GPU chip. Unlike multi core CPUs, not every PC process requires OpenCL so your software has to be OpenCL aware. So you would want to choose the device with the best GFLOP performance.
This is complex topic that has been discussed before about 100 times since VP11 came out. Basically the design of your motherboard, amount of RAM, and the speed, amount of cores, and instruction sets of your CPU matter more than your GPU. If your system is running slow ram vegas will be waiting. If your CPU is slow, your fast GPU will look unutilized, since it can complete its tasks so much faster. If you are running a motherboard like an X99, then there is enough CPU side bandwidth to operate multiple GPUs.
“GPU encoders” are dead. Fast CPU+GPU hybrid is a much faster way to go with better results. People that complain GPU does not work in Vegas normally have something else wrong with their configuration. The people that have a stable working configuration generally do not chime in on how much the GPU adds to the mix.
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I would just hit the easy button and upgrade if VP14 plays the file well. 4-5 years ago the 4k formats were still being worked of as far as consumer gear goes. It is possible that the format is AVC-Ultra (Panasonic’s version of AVC) in an MP4 container. VP12 may never play that type with out converting the media to another format.
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John is right.
I would add that you set your recording format in the audio hardware normally. You use the driver applications that came with your hardware to set record format, then you simple select the device or interfaces inside Vegas to record. That goes for the stock onboard audio interfaces also. If that makes any sense.
You should be able to search this forum, or other posts on Magix’s forum for people trying to use pro audio interfaces with Vegas. I know there have been several posts over the years on this topic.
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Not much info on the system specs, timeline media, or render format being attempted.
Did you try Sony AVC vs MC encoder? How about XDCAM-EX, does it also stop at the same point?
NVidia GPU with it enabled in Vegas? Did you try disabling GPU in Vegas?
Is your captured footage actually encoded to video standard like 1920x1080p@29.97 or 59.94? Is the frame rate constant or variable?
Did you try disabling all effects and seeing if the basic footage will render out? Then add back the effects types one at a time?
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“What I am going to try since my sound files are varied is to render all the audio separately as MP3 then bring them back to the timeline under my visuals and see”
This is backwards. All audio in editing stages should be in uncompressed (PCM). Why add a decompression layer to the mix and expect better results? Editing super compressed formats both audio (AAC, MP4, AC-3) and video (AVC) is is not very wise. Convert all editing media to a unified Pro format. The Pro codecs will always use uncompressed audio, and generally an intra-frame video codec. The intra frame exception being XDCAM format, which has been highly optimized by Sony for TV news production editing.
There is very little in the way of system spec info (PC and audio hardware), time line media details, FX details, or render output. Basically the poster expects the community to read between the lines and make assumptions on what is being attempted.
Basically this just sounds like a flame post against using Vegas, to try and swing people to Premiere.
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There have been several threads on the benefits of using an intermediate format for editing. You may want to use that project of yours as a test. There is significant overhead of decoding H264 group of pictures back into individual frames.
Create a new project to convert all your source media to xdcam-ex.MXF, or Cineform.avi (installed with GoPro software.), or even HDCAM-SR-LITE.MXF. For 4K media, convert to XAVC-intra or Cineform.AVI.
Move all your h264 media out of the main folder into a subfolder.
Move all the intermediate files into another subfolder.
Re-open the project and point vegas at the new intermediate files.
Do some play back tests to see what works the smoothest for what you want to do. You should see when Scrubbing on the timeline that you see all the frames played back quickly, vs jumping from frame 1 to frame 50 using h264 files.
Best Full setting uses a different scaler than Good, and does full computation on the frames. Preview does only what is needed to display the resolution being shown, and drops info to prioritize frame rate. I pretty much only use Best Full when color correcting or doing graphics. Then use Preview or even draft when editing to max frame rate.
With Vegas, you learn that rendering is sort of like baking. You create at less than best perfect image, and bake/render for 30 mins to see the final result. You may need to re-render, but you learn over time what to check at best full ram preview to lessen the need to re-render finals.
Final render using a Best Full Sony AVC/XAVC(4K) profile that matches your project. If you are going to YouTube, you can upload XDCAM (smart render for unmodified footage) and Cineform directly. YouTube and other services will throw away any extra bit rate.
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That system build should work very well with Vegas.
The RX480 should be pretty close to an R9-290X. The 480 will have support for more modern features (things like DP1.2A ports), use less power, and only a slightly less compute power (36 vs 44 compute units).
Here is a GPU grid I compile from wiki and other tech sites:
https://1drv.ms/x/s!Au_dLvF4HRtrhP9j2EWb3NDQXNQ3Bw
I need to update it to the latest specs out there.
The CPU is the only thing I would maybe change with your configuration, but only if you were going to add another GPU ,PCIe SSD, or capture interfaces like a Blackmagic card. You want the extra PCIe lanes from the CPU to support another GPU at 16X. I understand about the CPU costs however, the 6950x in the high-end Xeon range.
Since the newer x99 boards are now doing 2400 DDR4, you may want to make sure your BIOS is up to date. You may be able to run stable at the high freq. Test your system overnight at the higher frequency to make sure it is stable.
Were you able to get your system loaded NVME? There should be an NVME controller under computer management. That mode is what you are looking for with that M.2.
Run “winsat mem” from a admin command prompt, to verify you are getting the memory bandwidth you think you should be getting.
winsat disk will test the M2 performance, which you should be seeing like 1GB/s sequential and a huge amount of random performance (much higher than SATA)
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Mathew,
I would look at AMD X series chips with stream processors that evenly divide by 64. Wiki will provide a list of what series chip is being run in the different cards. Buyer beware, since some newer models are actually less performance than older X series. New models generally support other new features than pure compute performance.
RX480
290x
390X
fury-xLook a the GFLOP ratings between AMD cards. Most of the GPU effects that need the most acceleration are using math that you want the highest GFLOP rating. The best CPUs do not come closet to say a Fury-X in terms of GFLOP performance. Most of what you want from OpenCL assist is the quick return of complex math or floating point results while working in 32-bit FP mode.
“Core i7-6950X+DDR4-2133 = 497.1GFlops”
Fury-X = 8,600 GFLOPsGPU Memory bandwidth and normally in goes hand in hand with bus width, both are good indicators.
PCI3.0 is only 16GB/s roughly and so most GPUs and System memories are well beyond this, and yet they share large amounts of data between them. So any increase in PCI speeds is normally a good thing to look for. For example, PCI3.0 interface is not only faster than 2.0, but 3.0 offers less overhead and so offers a speed increase there as well.
Make sure your motherboard allows for all your extra interface cards (capture cards, PCIe SSD, even M.2, ect) to run on the CPU PCIe lanes and not the southbridge (x99 or other chipset designations.)
OpenCL versions would matter more but the software manufacturer (Magix) needs to implement the newer versions of OpenCL into the software. I believe Vegas 13-14 only supports 1.2.
Hope this helps.
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James sorry for taking so long to get back to you.
What was the reasoning for choosing the WX-5100 in the 1st place? You pretty much only need a FirePro card if you are trying to setup a 10-bit display path. I mean with regards to Vegas operation. Blackmagic has cards that will give you a monitor with 10bit display output if you need that type of path. If you want to go directly from your GPU, or have other applications that will utilize a Pro GPU features then the FirePro is a good choice too.
The 6950 or BWE series has the benefits of the improved stable memory speed of 2400 over 5960 series. Your board maybe able to overclock the memory past either 2100 or 2400, but make sure to run memtest86 overnight to verify there are zero errors with the controller or memory at new speeds.
When it comes to price performance , or is this one worth the other, that is really up to you to decide with your own testing and financial circumstances. Is your business writing off, or is the purchase just an expensive new toy.
When it comes to which series to buy, I would always buy the CPU with the most cores, operating frequency, the newest instruction sets, and best memory bandwidth. This all depends on how long you plan to use the CPU. One can only assume that Magix and other NLEs are actually working to take advantage of new instruction sets and OpenCL version as they come out. Sony in the past was not however. Buying an older CPU, means that advancements in software that takes advantage of new instructions will require a CPU upgrade. There is some leap frogging here.
Anandtech has a good article on the 6950x you may want to read.
PCper has some good into on the 6950x:
“Our synthetic performance tests start off very well for the Core i7-6950X, resulting in scores that are 29% faster than the 8-core 5960X and nearly 50% faster than the Core i7-6700K Skylake processor. “
There does not seem to be much testing going on with OpenCL benchmarking like Luxmark or others. Clearly posting some results of a Vegas test file in 32-FP mode would be a good judge of performance, but our NLE community is small in reality. Even AnandTech stopped using Vegas as benchmark, I feel because Sony no long owns it, and the results were topped out with almost no difference in new GPU releases. When in fact the benchmark file was not evolving with the times and resolutions, color depths.
A new Vegas test file that is playback/rendering a 4K EXR format with effects in 32-bit full mode, and then also rendering out to a 4K 10-bit HEVC format would be a good new benchmark. This would increase the complexity of the project and show a much greater difference in the speeds of the compute hardware setups.