Waiting for timecode

[Shane Ross]

Log and capture. This is really the only way to defeat timecode breaks. Or, if you don’t need timecode, capture using the UNCONTROLLABLE DEVICE setting and manually control the camera…but this is really a bad way of doing it.

And blacking a tape before you shoot does not prevent timecode breaks…all it does it make the tape more susceptable to dropout, as you are now recording over a used tape. When you shoot, the camera BLOWS OVER what is on the tape (including timecode) and records it’s own image and timecode.

[Kevin C.]

thanks so much Shane.
Wow! I read in a couple of Digital Filmaking books this idea of recording the full tape beforehand with black cap to have a continuous timecode. so this was my first test. In fact my first shoot with actors etc.

And in fact, when I went to capture, I had massive timecode problems, and massive dropped frame warning coming up.
Man, so much for reading books.

So, while I’m shooting, I guess best way to prevent timecode breaks is just to make sure not stop the tape and forward to a point beyond where you last shot, correct?

Now I had FCP 1,2, 3, but when got Tiger 3 would not work, and bought Express HD. It looked like it had virtually everything I would need for semi-pro use. But I just found out yesterday. It does not log and capture! dang.

So I’m doing Capture now, which is cool, Tom Wolsky prefers that anyway, but Uncontrollable Device, never seen that or heard of that.

[Shane Ross]

Really? Books say that? In my experience that has never worked, as cameras do what are called ASSEMBLE EDITS, in effect. They just blow over what was recorded earlier. INSERT EDIT (these are post terms) means that you lay picture on exisitng timecode, and in my experience no camera can do that.

Hey, if FCP was doing it for you, why uprade to Tiger? FCP 3 is far mor powerful than FCE. Log and capture…keyframing…tons of stuff.

[Bouncing Account needs new email address]

[Kevin C.] “So, while I’m shooting, I guess best way to prevent timecode breaks is just to make sure not stop the tape and forward to a point beyond where you last shot, correct?”

No, NOT correct. If you do what you described, it will GUARANTEE a timecode reset.

Here’s the method:
If you choose to stop and playback a section of your recording during the shoot, you can make SURE you don’t let the TC reset buy doing THIS:

1. After you playback to the end of your last shot
2. Rewind (“Search” back) just a few seconds
3. Play to the end again but WATCH the TC numbers and SEE where they END.
4. Rewind (“Search” back) just a few seconds AGAIN
5. Play to ALMOST the end of the TC but hit PAUSE (that’s PAUSE, not Stop) anytime before the TC runs out.
6. DO NOT HIT STOP
7. (While the tape is still PAUSED) switch the camcorder from VCR to CAMERA mode.
8. You’re NOW ready to go right on shooting from there with no TC reset.

Seems like a lot to remember, but if you DO this, you’ll not have the “Reset TC Blues” during the edit.

And to Shane,

[Shane Ross] “all it does it make the tape more susceptable to dropout, as you are now recording over a used tape.”

Except for the above statement, I agree with all of your post about PRE-BLACKING. No need to do it.

But, I hardly call a single pass and rewind a “used tape”.
Sony and others claim a DV tape is “good” for dozens of re-uses and I’ve never had a failure on any “work-tapes” that I’ve used over and over in the edit bay.

Some shooters actually suggest that playing or recording (even fast-forward/rewinding) a tape thru before “actual use” lessens the chances for drop-outs as the heads can “brush away” any loose particles that may be left after manufacture.

I’m not saying I put much stock in this either (no pun inteneded), but it is “one of those things” that gets oft-repeated until it becomes LORE in the biz.

Again, I DO agree that pre-striping a camcorder tape is not much more than a wasted hour of head-wear.

[Kevin C.]

Shane:
I upgraded to Tiger, not knowing that FCP would not work with it. Who the heck would know that??

I was very pissed off, when the tech at Apple informed me. He did not seem to care too much. (In fact is seems Apple takes great delight in that)

thanks Matte:
that is hard to follow but I think the gist if that you do not want to ever start recording past the point of the last recorded moment. no?

that’s the only way to break timecode right? if you stop and then start past last recorded moment.
BTW is “timecode reset= breaking timecode”?

[Shane Ross]

[Kevin C.] “I upgraded to Tiger, not knowing that FCP would not work with it. Who the heck would know that??”

People who use FCP. Next time something big like a new OS or version of FCP comes out, ask for information here about compatibility issues, or the Apple FCP discussions. Get answers from people who use this stuff professionally, and dig and research and read lots of stuff before they upgrade.

[Kevin C.] “I was very pissed off, when the tech at Apple informed me. He did not seem to care too much. (In fact is seems Apple takes great delight in that)”

Please don’t equate the Apple Techs knowledge (or lack thereof) and poor attitude as the attitude of Apple. Employees SHOULD be the representatives of the company, but many aren’t and are only their for the paycheck. Apple cares…that employeee doesn’t.

[Kevin C.] “that’s the only way to break timecode right? if you stop and then start past last recorded moment.”

Or if you turn off the camera…sometimes this does it too. Not often, but sometimes. Most often it occurs when people review the last shot and stop the tape AFTER the image ends. Use mattes method and you will be fine.

[Kevin C.] “BTW is “timecode reset= breaking timecode”?”
Yes, that will do it too.

And Matte, thanks for the update on recording over and over tapes. I guess I am still thinking Beta and Digibeta…those were the formats I used when I was shooting. Just carrying over those concepts. Thanks for correcting me.

[Kevin C.]

Shane, that’s interesting what you are saying.

There are folks on FCP 3, then who would like to go to Tiger, but decide not to. Does that suck or what? Can’t Apple make sure the new OS versions will work with important softwares like FCP 3, or is this incompatibility only after a few years intentional?

[Shane Ross]

FCP 3 came out when many people were still using OS9…and OSX was BRAND new. It was made so that it could work with the new OS, but not optimally. Many of us opted to use FCP on OS9. That FCP just cannot really access the resources in the new OS (or so I am told…I am not a programmer).

But hey, I am currently editing on an Avid running OS 9. It works, and it works well.

If you use the machine as an editing station, and you are still using FCP 3, then why upgrade? You gain nothing. If you MUST upgrade the OS, then it is time to upgrade the FCP version.

[Kevin C.]

thanks Shane:
Well , FCP is one of many , many things I use my G5 for, but had I known, maybe I would not have upgraded, for sure. Someone mentioned I could boot into Panther and use FCP 3, but it is bit of hassle. I still think Apple are pricks for doing this though, is that too harsh