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Tedious track based editing
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[Oliver Peters] “And no, putting projects/sequences/timelines into an event is simply messing up the design of the NLE, not to mention bloat.”
Bloat tossed aside for a moment, it is actually one of the things I find appealing. I feel it is not “messing” with the design, rather that’s a feature of the design.
Make your selects in favorite ranges, sort by favorites, selects all clips, make a compound called “whatever_you_want__selects” and make a smart collection that searches for “__selects” and any other compound that you make after that you’d finish with “__selects” and they’d all be in one place. Note that’s two underscores.
Yet another way is to make keyword collection ranges like “Acceptance of the blindness”, select all those, make a compound, and make a smart collection from those compounds.
I work in sequences too, and lots of them. Your picture from the blog of the folder and the myriad of sequences could easily be an FCPX Event, except the sequences would be skimmable compound clips, and the folder would be a folder :).
Having the sequences in the Event above the Project I find to be handy, but I know its just me.
I find the compounds to be a work area, and the Project down below to be a bit more fleshed out. I can add clips from the Event Compound and break them apart in the Project. I can always go back to the original favorited ranges, or the original clip itself.
As I said earlier, I am often wrong, so I’m sure my methods make me an unprofessional.
Jeremy
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[Oliver Peters] “It’s these jobs – where the editor is “the writer” and you are trying to find the story arc through the juxtaposition of clips – that require a ton of sequences. The fact that it’s hard to have many, many “projects” tied to one production and that the UI gives you minimal custom text entry and feedback, make FCP X a hard NLE to use if this is your style.”
Exactly. Ironic, isn’t it? Especially with the way Apple markets FCPX as letting you “focus on your story”.
[Oliver Peters] “For example, FCP X would work much better if there were a simple list view alternative of the project library with a notes field. Or sequence-based markers.”
Great idea. Hope you’ve made it a feature request.
[Oliver Peters] “And no, putting projects/sequences/timelines into an event is simply messing up the design of the NLE, not to mention bloat.”
I’m often impressed at the work arounds people come up with to get the app to do what they need. But yeah, the design likes things to be a certain way and you can only push so hard against it before things get ugly.
_______________________
David Lawrence
art~media~design~research
propaganda.com
publicmattersgroup.com
facebook.com/dlawrence
twitter.com/dhl -
[Steve Connor] “So did he relate what these systems are?”
Not in specific detail, but he did mention the importance of flexible custom bin structures, sequences and transcripts. I got the impression that the methods Oliver discusses here and in his blog post come into play as well. On top of that, he was a beta tester for GET before it became Soundbite and I know it’s become a key component in his workflow. I’ll ask him if he wants to poke his head in this discussion and say more. Or better yet, if Timmy W. is interested, maybe he could be coaxed into doing an article. He’s a good writer and has written for the COW magazine in the past. I would love to learn more about how he and his teams work.
[Steve Connor] “In reality this isn’t true at all, but I can understand how it might be the perception of people who haven’t used the software”
That may be right, but unfortunately it seems to be the perception in the feature documentary scene in LA. There’s no incentive for people like my friend to try it. They have too may other options and they’re too busy making movies to start everything from scratch.
_______________________
David Lawrence
art~media~design~research
propaganda.com
publicmattersgroup.com
facebook.com/dlawrence
twitter.com/dhl -
[Jeremy Garchow] “Bloat tossed aside for a moment, it is actually one of the things I find appealing. I feel it is not “messing” with the design, rather that’s a feature of the design.”
I don’t think you can ignore the bloat. Look at my blog post and the documentary workflow I describe. I’m talking about whittling down 60+ hours of footage into a series of shorter and more focused timelines. If you did this all via compounds, you’d end up with compound inside compound ad infinitum. Just think of what permutations this would have for your final project! You’d never get to the end, because about halfway through, the app would never be able to complete loading everything!
I’m not saying you can’t cut this type of documentary. Simply that if this is your approach, then you will have to completely alter your editing strategy with FCP X.
– Oliver
Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com -
[Franz Bieberkopf] “What sorts of issues have you encountered with PPro and this approach?”
I miss the level of textual organization FCP 7 and Media Composer enables. Lots of user-defined columns and better Find structures.
Another problem with PPro – one that Adobe Anywhere appears to try to solve – is the situation of two or more editors collaborating. Let’s say you assign an assistant the task to cut a scene or assemble a timeline of selects on a second system with duplicate media files. When you import his edited sequence into your PPro project, it creates a folder with the sequence AND duplicates of the master clips used in that timeline. If you delete them because they are duplicates of the master clips that are already in your project, then all the clip in that sequence disappear.
– Oliver
Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com -
[Oliver Peters] “I don’t think you can ignore the bloat. “
No, you can’t at this point.
But if compounds in the event weren’t supposed to be a design feature, they wouldn’t let you right click and make them right in the Event. Certainly, the performance of them needs to be fixed. If they were fast performing, then this would be an excellent feature for me.
[Oliver Peters] “I’m talking about whittling down 60+ hours of footage into a series of shorter and more focused timelines. “
Yes. This is easily what I do all the time, and I find FCPX does not hinder this workflow for me. I rather like having the Project down below and a visual skimmable set of compounds above. It’s almost like having two simultaneous “timelines” open and instantly viewable without having to switch tabs, or double click a clip in to the viewer. Of course I can’t see them both at the same time as in a viewer and canvas, but I can easily switch back and forth either through skimming or through keyboard commands.
[Oliver Peters] “If you did this all via compounds, you’d end up with compound inside compound ad infinitum”
I am particularly looking at this picture from your blog:
https://digitalfilms.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/blg_lrgproj_4.jpg?w=640
This could easily be compound clips.
I have often argued that the make a bunch of sequences is how FCP7 is best suited, either by design or accident. There is no better way to slog through footage than to lay it all out and start cutting away at it when you are going through that much interview/dialog content, which in essence, is skimming and editing. FCPX can do this as well.
Surely, it looks different, but the very idea, I find, is very similar.
[Oliver Peters] “Simply that if this is your approach, then you will have to completely alter your editing strategy with FCP X.”
Indeed.
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[Jeremy Garchow] “[Oliver Peters] “Simply that if this is your approach, then you will have to completely alter your editing strategy with FCP X.”
Indeed.
“
can we not just say it is dying on the vine now?
Isn’t this a deliciously near dead editing system? The motion of editing?
haven’t we actually killed it?
can’t we pop balloons?
https://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics
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Is that the royal “we”?
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I can actually answer this – if you grab an edit point for a ripple trim pushing against timeline start – it actually sucks timeline start against you. timeline start is magnetic. no. i”m not kidding – its that stupid.
the default behaviour of FCPX is that time is relative to your current decision – you can suck time start absolute left against you.
again – I’m not joking – this is the degree to which they smoked special cigarettes in cupertino – in the process of destroying a decade industry standard.
https://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics
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aaalrightie now – one citizen under constitution to another…
https://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics
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