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RES Seminar on HD & the Future of Filmmaking – 5 Cows
HD is finally taking off. If you’re buying a digital camera, or if your brain is still in 29.97 mode, like mine is, I highly recommend this seminar when Resfest comes to your area.
It is lead by cinematograher, David Leitner.
Leitner mainly discusses the state of the industry, then covers a few of the pros and cons of prominent and upcoming DV cameras. You pick up things you won’t get at a sales presentation – like how one manufacturer puts standard lenses on their HD cameras.
He also mentioned facts such as Hi Def cameras don’t handle low light as well – but on the other hand, noise reduction is superior, so HD gain looks significantly better.
He was very happy the way Final Cut Pro 5.0 handles HD.Since HD is relatively new, there are a lot of compatibility issues. For example, HD audio is generally crummy. But JVC came out with superior PZM audio for their cameras, which unfortunately won’t play out on Sony decks.
He showed several videos , but the house projector was too antiquated to give an accurate visual comparison. The Sony HVR-Z1U footage should have looked better.
A couple of notable cameras –
The new and tiny, Panasonic DVC Pro HD P2 will shoot at 60 fps for slo mo. There is not a single moving element in the camcorder.
The upcoming Canon HD XLH1 shoots stunning footage. By far the best shown. Unfortunately, some of the motion was a little steppy. No one knew whether this was a problem with the camcorder or the projector. The other downside is that Canon will price it at $9,000, which puts it out of reach for many independents.
Leitner was annoyed by the tiny controls on all of the new camcorders. On night shoots, you actually have to stop shooting, and get out a flashlight to flip switches.
Another sore point is how hulking lenses look on the compact new camcorders. One had a pull-out wire “foot” to keep the camera stable when it is put down. It’s surprising that lens manufacturers are so far behind in innovation.
The two hours went by very quickly, It could easily have been expanded to a half day.
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11 Replies
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Hi,
All I can say is the DVCPRO HD footage that I showed the day before in my seminar looked great on that “antiquated” projector which BTW is a very expensive DLP projctor with about 6000 to 7000 lumens. That projector holds its own up against the high end Christies. There may have problems but it was not with the projector. In hind sight, perhaps I should have let the HVX “lab” footage be shown and then the projector would not be taking the hit.
Yes I thought the Canon Camera’s footage looked fairly good. However I did think it was odd that the Canon had recorded its image to DVCPRO HD via the HD-SDI instead of its own HDV drive, so we really don’t know how the HDV algorithm is going to handle the Canon 24F mode, we only know how well DVCPRO HD records it. The DVCPRO HD playback looked fine except for a few stuttering parts, which again I can assure you that it was not a part of the projection system.
Best,
Jan
Jan Crittenden Livingston
Product Manager, DVCPRO, DVCPRO50, AG-DVX100
Panasonic Broadcast & TV Systems -
Jan,
Thanks for setting me straight. The presentor implied that the projection might not have been optimal, and tried to show a documentary that kept skipping and stuttering. I don’t know whether that was the fault of the material or the projector. Knowing little about video projectors, I can only relay what is said by those with more expertise and experience. -
We reached a point where the playing field was evening out. DV rivaled betacam, and talent was the factor to success, not big money. The dream of the little guy with talent is being killed off. Companies like Discovery HD theater won’t air more than 15% of any show in HDV. Now, Networks won’t accept anything that isn’t shot on the Sony 900 or 950 or the Panasonic Varicam.
The only way to combat this is to have channels devoted to more interesting content as opposed to the toniest quality.
If the talent pool is better on the dv stations, that is what the viewer will be watching. -
Jean,
If I may suggest to avoid confusion when referring to these new breed of cameras you should specifically refer to HDV versus HD.
HDV is the prosumer line of JVC, Sony and Canon are offering among other brands. The Canon however also allows outputting HD-SDI for external recording.
HD in my world would refer to the high end professional series Sony F900/F950 Cine Alta, Panasonic VariCam, Grass Valley Viper,Panavision Genesis etc
In the middle of all this is the forthcoming HVX-200 dvcproHD P2 camcorder.
The high end high def cameras handle low light very well so I am confused at the statement you made. Prehaps David meant high lights which is still an issue with most of the low end HDV and high end HD cameras with the exception of the Viper.
Regarding the ease of use of tiny switches and controls it should be noted that none of the HDV prosumer as well as some of the mid to high HD camcorders are designed or tailored specifically to match the ease of operation on existing motion picture cameras. Using a prosumer product in an environment such as a film feature is at best a painful experience for those DP’s who are accustomed to working with professional motion picture equipment and accessories. The concept is similar to using a stock volkwagen bug to race at next year’s Indy 500.
The exception to the rule are new HD cameras designed by Panavision Genesis and Arri D20 which started out with a film style body design from the beginning.
Image quality is only one part of the job ease of operation and quick access to controls are vital when time is of the essence.
Regarding the large lenses if you think they are big you should take a look at most of the Panavision film or digital cinematography line of lenses. When mounted onto a F900 the camera is the size of a handheld missle launcher.
One last note 9K for the Canon camera is quite cheap given it offers HD-SDI output as well as genlock and timecode I/O.
The introduction of that camera will most likely start a price war between the other manufacturers hoping to gain an edge.
Tony Salgado
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>When mounted onto a F900 the camera is the size of a handheld missle launcher.< If Mother Nature can make a lens the size of a fly eyeball, lens manufacturers should be able to scale things down a bit more. I agree that manufacturers, not consumors are driving the move to HD. Years before the digital revolution, I heard a Sony rep say that they had tremendous technology that they would not implement because it would undercut customers who had made heavy investments in linear equipment.
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Tony-
Thanks for the post.>The high end high def cameras handle low light very well so I am confused at the statement you made. Prehaps David meant . . .< No, David stated that the cameras didn't handle low light situations well, but gain looked better because of the improved noise suppression. The discussion didn't cover high-end HD cameras used in feature films. My intent was to give highlights of a good seminar on cameras affordable to independents. Sorry about any confusion!
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Most people frequenting Cow would not be in the market for a $100k camera, and would not
find this review confusing at all.My company wouldn’t even be in the market for a $100 camera.
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By the end of next year the cost of entry into the higher end professional HD cameras will be dropping dramatically.
So the need to separate the prosumer equipment from the higher end professional gear is necessary to understand what the differences are in terms of image quality, durability and intended use.
A apple to apples comparision of anything is only possible if you first identify them as apples first not grapes or oranges.
Tony Salgado
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I don’t think that many Creative Cow subscribers expected that post to be a discussion of $100,000 cameras.
Wrong constituency. The future of filmmaking to Res readers and Cow regulars, means filmmaking that we can afford and within the budget range of the average digital department.Why don’t you consider writing an article on the difference between $100,000 cameras and our $3,000 – $7,000
cameras? If you are qualified, many of us would be interested in reading what you have to say. -
Carter,
Then again by what you stated if the the article is targeted for the wrong audience as you see it what worth is it?
In anycase I think you may be missing the point I was making in understanding the line of separation between high end, middle ground and prosumer equipment.
It important when using specific terms to understand what one is specifically referring to.
I hope you understand that.
Tony Salgado
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