One year later…

[Andrew Kimery]

My experience has been closer to Chris Harlan’s than Chris Kenny’s.

Whenever I run into someone (either online or in the real world) that is optimistic or interested w/FCP X I’m initially taken back because it happens so infrequently. Maybe it’s because lots of the work that I do isn’t, or doesn’t appear to be, conducive to FCPX’s workflow so maybe it’s just that I don’t swim in the circles that even see FCPX as a possibility. I don’t know really.

W/o knowing more details about the SCRI numbers it’s hard to know what they really mean. How many people are using FCPX day in and day out and how many played w/it for a few hours and haven’t touched it sense? I mean, last year Adobe claimed some huge number of PPro installs (more than FCP classic) but how many of those are people actually using PPro vs PPro just came along for the ride in the CS purchase?

A few years ago a SCRI study showed FCP w/like 52% of the NLE market and Avid w/22% while an ACE survey from the same period showed like 80% of ACE members used Avid and 20% used FCP. W/o having more granular data (data that reflects your market, interests, workflows, and needs) the numbers aren’t very useful in creating an accurate picture of what’s going w/in all the niches that make up post production.

-Andrew

2.9 GHz 8-core (4,1), FCP 7.0.3, 10.6.6
Blackmagic Multibridge Eclipse (7.9.5)

[Craig Seeman]

So if Avid discontinued its front end for Isis it would still have the same ROI value to you?
I was a big fan of Unity at one point, trying to push the company I worked for to buy one . . . but there was a lot less competition in that market 10 years ago.

This is the hypothetical:
If I bought a Media Composer in 2000 and Avid abandoned it, I’d still have a perfectly functional Mac, The proprietary cards and the software through were a large part of the cost and value. I certainly would have been able to install FCP but there’d be a lot of lost ROI.

I can add Avid Shuttle hard drive systems into the equation as well. That was just a bit bucket. It was a much more expensive bit bucket though.

My business question is, if Avid abandoned their Unity/Isis integration software etc, would there be loss on ROI. It’s still a bit bucket but Avid MC circa 2000 was still a Mac. That wasn’t its primary cost or value though.

I’m honestly not sure how closely the feature, benefit, value is tied to anything Avid proprietary involved if such proprietary function were lost. Maybe very little or none . . . but I’m not sure, not having investigated or setup such a system lately. Additionally if Avid doesn’t add much proprietary value then why go with that as a business decision. I’m wondering because I do think there are business that use Media Composer and Symphony and aren’t purchasing Unity/Isis because they are finding value elsewhere. I think this may be part of Avid’s financial problems.

Basically it would seem to me that many people using MC and those now crossgrading to Symphony are choosing other mass storage management solutions. Assuming that’s true (yes just an assumption), why aren’t they seeing the added benefit in Unity/Isis?

[Craig Seeman]

Apple has been revealing a road map for FCPX to some extent for some months now. It doesn’t change the past but they are to some extent doing it now and to people who are not part of the past, that’s all they will see.

MacBookPros and iMacs lead in their categories and Apple is the number 3 PC maker in the USA with sales in those categories going up while most of the computer industry is going down. This is hardy a company that’s going to abandon a reliable growth market.

[Herb Sevush]

[Chris Kenny] “If I were building a new facility today for in-house create editorial (i.e. not suites rented to outside editors, where you have just offer what they want), the ‘standard’ editing machine would absolutely be iMac + Thunderbolt RAID & video I/O + FCP X.”

And if I were advising someone I would recommend Windows boxes, where for the same or less price you have a much larger choice of GPUs, and with PCIe and USB3 you can customize exactly what you want at a great price; and for software any of PPro, Avid, Edius, Vegas or Lightworks that suits your needs. Greater variety, more customization and less subject to the whims of any single company, especially those who might decide they know more about your work than you do. I’d also suggest they brush up on Linux and have a Linux boot stick ready and waiting.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
—————————
nothin’ attached to nothin’
“Deciding the spine is the process of editing” F. Bieberkopf

[Jeremy Garchow]

[Herb Sevush] “And if I were advising someone I would recommend Windows boxes, where for the same or less price you have a much larger choice of GPUs, and with PCIe and USB3 you can customize exactly what you want at a great price; and for software any of PPro, Avid, Edius, Vegas or Lightworks that suits your needs. Greater variety, more customization and less subject to the whims of any single company, especially those who might decide they know more about your work than you do. I’d also suggest they brush up on Linux and have a Linux boot stick ready and waiting.”

Just curious, but have you done any of this yet?

I’m not calling you out, I am just wondering if people really are buying every system, OS and GPU available, and still working their day jobs, or sleeping.

[Andrew Richards]

[Chris Harlan] “Personally, I can’t remember a single post where-in anyone was predicting an immediate mass exodus from FCP 7. Frankly, I can’t imagine anyone that uses/used FCP7 in business making such a silly claim.”

I can remember claims to that effect, though not necessarily coming from facility bosses like our esteemed Mr. Raudonis and Mr. Biscardi. Tom Daigon and Grege Burke spring to mind as particularly vociferous mass-exodus soothsayers in this forum who walked their walk into the arms of Adobe and Avid last summer. There were others too.

Maybe the distinction is immediate mass exodus. But at the very least, there were plenty of exodus predictions to go around last summer.

Best,
Andy

[Lance Bachelder]

Funny I talk to my Mac fanboy friends about this all the time. While I’ve had Macs and PCs running since the Windows 3.1 and OS7 days, most of my production friends are Mac only. And most of them are mad at Apple for FCPX… so they exact their revenge by installing Premiere or Avid or whatever on their Mac?

I’ll show Apple, I’ll use my iPhone less and maybe not buy as many tracks on iTunes and when the new iMac ships I’ll have someone else install the RAM for me… I’m gonna make them pay!

Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California

[Andrew Richards]

[Jason J Rodriguez] “At the moment, Adobe is listening, Apple is not, so it’s really not a difficult decision on our part.”

I think it is unfair to say Apple isn’t listening. They aren’t talking (much), but they insist they are listening. They have also now released in essence three consecutive near-term feature roadmaps, which is more than they ever did before. They delivered the first two with the features they promised in the timeframe they promised them in.

I can’t argue they aren’t needlessly secretive when it comes to certain product lines, and I sympathize with you vis a vis their long history of one-way customer communication.

But not talking and not listening are two very different things. One-way customer communication is very frustrating though, I get that.

Best,
Andy

[Herb Sevush]

[Jeremy Garchow] “I’m not calling you out, I am just wondering if people really are buying every system, OS and GPU available”

The idea isn’t to buy everything available. The idea is that you “can” buy anything available.

If I buy an Imac I’m stuck with a small selection of GPU’s. I can use Tbolt for connectivity but I don’t think it will be as fast or flexible as PCIe 3. I’m stuck with the built in Apple monitor.

The Imac encapsulates much of what I never liked about Apple in the first place – closed system, limited options. The rewards of Apple’s design philosophy are stability and efficiency. I guess I value flexibility over stability. Which in another thread many months ago I mentioned as reasons I didn’t like the design philosophy of FCPX. I’m nothing if not consistent.

If there is no new MacPro or equivalent come June I have a multitude of vendors, price points and system designs to choose from in the PC world. I’m comfortable with any of those choices, it comes down to matching hardware to software.

Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
—————————
nothin’ attached to nothin’
“Deciding the spine is the process of editing” F. Bieberkopf

[Andrew Richards]

[Chris Kenny] “If I were building a new facility today for in-house create editorial (i.e. not suites rented to outside editors, where you have just offer what they want), the ‘standard’ editing machine would absolutely be iMac + Thunderbolt RAID & video I/O + FCP X.”

iMac + Thunderbolt SANlink & video I/O + FCP X + Xsan/StorNext

Fixed that for you. We are talking about a facility, right? 🙂

Best,
Andy