Music Video shot on Red Cam 3K and 5d editing on FCP

[Shane Ross]

So you did all of this conversion without talking to an online editor first? Because they will be the ones tackling this online.

Workflows ALWAYS ALWAYS have to be done in a specific manner… find out what you will be delivering, and work backwards. Gear your workflow to making that happen. Think of the finishing, and figure out how getting the footage into the system for the offline creative cut will facilitate the online.

Reconnoissance … looking down the road at the obstacles so you can devise a plan on how to best approach things. That’s what is needed. Not just grabbing a machete and hacking your way through the jungle. Who knows if you will hit a river, or a big cliff…and then need to find a way to get around it.

Red has about a dozen different workflows…all based on how you will be finishing. Canon 5D? Well, that’s a different beast, but has a more straight forward workflow…if you were staying at 1080. But 3K and 1080p…see, you need to figure out if you will be finishing in 2K, or 1080…all sorts of things.

Put that machete away…

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
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[Steve Watkins]

I did talk to a few pro editor friends of mine before blindly stumbling off but I do have a lot to learn. converting the footage to DVCProHD wasn’t a lot of work. just took a few hours of processing time.

In the tv world of avid and physical tapes, we’d capture at 10:1, edit and up res before color.

now working at home on a personal project, I couldn’t play back the Red footage or the 5d footage easily on my G5 in their native formats. So I was advised to transcode to DVCProHD and up res later before handing it over to color.

how i finish, is what I’m trying to find out. I have a pro color house in LA doing the color on this. I was just looking for some info on what the best frame size and frame rate is for the master copy. For Airplay/DVD/Blueray/Web quality?

[Scott Sheriff]

Steve,
“What frame size should my final product be?”

It usually works best to know what your delivery format is going to be, and work backwards from that all the way back to acquisition.

I would think that ProRes would be better than DVCPro.
And not knowing what your delivery requirement is, I’m just gonna throw out that sticking with the 5D’s native frame size of 1920×1080, and bringing the RED down to that would be better than bringing them both down to 720, unless that is the desired finish frame size.

Just a guess on my part. I bet the big guns on the forum will come along soon with better advice.

Scott Sheriff
Director
SST Digital Media
https://www.sstdigitalmedia.com

[Steve Watkins]

thanks for the advice. you’re a bigger gun than i, in this world.

this is a music video that I’m directing and cutting (at home) the color place is 100% pro with pro gear and he’s doing it as a favor to my producers and I.

so “delivery requirement”, meaning the desired final product or how I had it to my color house?

I guess I just want the sharpest picture possible right? is there a standard delivery format for HD music videos?

I think I’m not being as clear as I can. I’m trying though

[Shane Ross]

[Steve Watkins] ” have a pro color house in LA doing the color on this. I was just looking for some info on what the best frame size and frame rate is for the master copy.”

Ask them. Call them and talk to them NOW. If they are going to do the finish, then you need to ask them for the workflow to best accomplish this, since they will be the ones doing this. Or are they only doing the color correct? If so…you need to ask them what they expect you to be handing them to color correct, and then work from there.

[Steve Watkins] “For Airplay/DVD/Blueray/Web quality?”

That’s a WIDE gambit. Airplay? Broadcast TV? OK…HDCAM SR? HDCAM? D5? Digibeta?

DVD…that’s SD… and BluRay tops out at 1080…so you might be looking at finishing at 1080. But HOW will you author to BluRay? DVD? Output to tape? These are the questions you need to know the answer to.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
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[Shane Ross]

[Steve Watkins] “I guess I just want the sharpest picture possible right? is there a standard delivery format for HD music videos?”

There is no standard when it come to HD. SD had more standards. 29.97fps 720×486. PERIOD. HD? 4K, 2K, 1080i, 720p…23.98, 29.97, 59.94…HDCAM SR, D5, HDCAM, DVCPRO HD, XDCAM HD, HDV… the list goes on. The History Channel has TWO deliverables. HDCAM and D5…720p and 1080psf.

Ask them what they want from you. THey might not be using FCP to color correct, they might be using an Avid DS Symphony…or Smoke, or DaVinci. And those require certain file types…so ask.

Communication is key.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def

[Steve Watkins]

Thanks for taking the time to help me out.

all good points. the project lives on a TB external drive (backed up else where). I’m happy to do the up res at my place on my G5 to the drive or I could take it to the color house and use one of their faster computers. I don’t want to impose though. They are coloring the video for free, doing my team and I a favor.

as for the “Master”; If I was a production company making a music video for a band/label how would I deliver the master? how would they send it to MTV/FUSE/MuchMusic for airplay? and would that be the highest quality the production company would export? I just want to end up with the highest quality music video as the footage allows.

[Steve Watkins]

the color house is using a stand alone system. it’s like a DaVinci (he says it’s better). I didn’t think the frame size had anything to do with color.

[Shane Ross]

[Steve Watkins] “If I was a production company making a music video for a band/label how would I deliver the master? how would they send it to MTV/FUSE/MuchMusic for airplay?”

You would ask them what their requirements are. Having worked recently on an MTV show, they want HDCAM SR 1080i, 29.97with 12 channels of audio in a very specific configuration. The other places? Gotta ask them. There is no standard.

[Steve Watkins] “and would that be the highest quality the production company would export? I just want to end up with the highest quality music video as the footage allows.”

Then you will need an HD capture card, rent an HDCAM SR deck…get someone who knows how to manage that deck (very complicated)…and who knows how to output to tape the finished color corrected file. There is a reason that people make a living solely as ONLINE EDITORS. All they do is finish shows and output to tape.

Wait…a G5 and RED and Canon 5D? Owwwww. You are in for a long and painful road. That machine is severely underpowered for the more accepted workflows…mainly ProRes. You need Intel macs to deal with that.

Are you in the Los Angeles area?

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
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[Shane Ross]

[Steve Watkins] “t’s like a DaVinci (he says it’s better).”

OK..”like a DaVinci” sounds like, well, it isn’t but they want you to think it will be as good. There are many options that are that good. COLOR is one. If this is being done in COLOR, that’s a bonus, as that is part of the Final Cut Studio suite, and that means that your FCP project will get their easier. BUT, to get things to Color, you have to prep properly. Can’t mix formats and frame sizes. Everything needs to match.

[Steve Watkins] “I didn’t think the frame size had anything to do with color.”

Color correcting 2K requires specific hardware (say like an AJA Kona 3), and not all software can do it either. Color can though.

Shane

GETTING ORGANIZED WITH FINAL CUT PRO DVD…don’t miss it.
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def