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In-Action Story on FCPX and Focus
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[Richard Herd] “[tony west] ““What I love about Final Cut Pro X is that it allowed me to be involved with, and in control of, every aspect of making our film.””
That quote jumped out at me too.
[tony west] “What does that statement mean to you?”
Is the editor a monkey on the keyboard, a “human user interface” that the director controls instead of a keyboard?”
Yes…that. Hee. Also that it’ll make the tool so simple that the directors might not THINK they need an editor anymore, because, hey, THEY can now use the software, so why do they need an editor. Although many many smart directors know the value of a good editor, as do producers and studios. But I’m darn sure that having directors editing alongside editors, might muddy the creative waters.
But, whatever. As long as the NLE does what is needed, and everyone is comfortable using it, who am I do say “that NLE sucks for this…how dare they edit a mighty feature with iMovie PRO!” Of course not. If it works, and everyone likes it…fine.
Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def -
[Shane Ross] “Yes…that. Hee. Also that it’ll make the tool so simple that the directors might not THINK they need an editor anymore, because, hey, THEY can now use the software, so why do they need an editor.”
On a smaller scale I work on projects like that all the time. I get called in at the end to clean up the mess. 😉 OTOH, I’ve also worked with some hands-on director/editors who are quite good.
– Oliver
Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com -
I find it interesting that the “Well… FCP X’s strengths really only help out the assistant editor.” keeps being brought up. I think the more producers start to understand the time savings at the start and end of post FCP X gives you it will start to be taken more seriously.
Currently I’m working on a lower budget film, under $5 million, shot on two Red epic cameras.
On the days where the camera crews used a Lockit box for jam syncing the timecode, and the sound person labeled the takes correctly I could sync and relabel the dailies in less than two minutes, and this is including dragging in the Red raw footage.
This gets the editor cutting scenes much faster during production, mistakes can be spotted in the footage faster allowing for reshoots when needed.
The iXML data even comes through into FCP X labeling all the multichannel WAV file tracks automatically for exporting to the sound mix. Avid cannot do this and it’s a big pile of work entering in that information by hand.
I helped out on this film called “Starry Eyes”, it had a great festival run getting into SXSW, and a small theatrical run.
This film was shot on two Red Epic cams and cut by one of the directors in FCP X in his kitchen on a 2011 iMac. This was the first feature for him, his only other editing experience was cutting his own short films.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2793490/?ref_=nv_sr_1
He had an assistant help prep the footage and worked with him on a rough stringout and then took over. He then cut in proxy mode till picture lock, flipped the switch back to ‘original media’ and exported to Resolve.
No days of conforming, checking sync, repositioning, all the handoff work was done.
The hiccup they had was creating the AAF as a result of improperly made multicam clips. (They didn’t read the manual) This was fixed by Gregory Clarke via a doctored XML from Intelligent Assistance even though it wasn’t caused by their software.
Having been through this, the bean counters are going to eventually take notice that certain set in stone time consuming and labor intensive costly steps can be avoided with FCP X.
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[Darren Roark] “On the days where the camera crews used a Lockit box for jam syncing the timecode, and the sound person labeled the takes correctly I could sync and relabel the dailies in less than two minutes, and this is including dragging in the Red raw footage. “
Agreed that setting up multicam in X and PPro is w-a-y faster than in Avid or FCP Legend. The first PPro project I worked on was multicam (2-3 cameras plus second system sound) and I could do in minutes what would take hours in Avid.
[Darren Roark] “The iXML data even comes through into FCP X labeling all the multichannel WAV file tracks automatically for exporting to the sound mix. Avid cannot do this and it’s a big pile of work entering in that information by hand.”
Avid can read BWF metadata though so if one was working on a project that was going to be cut on Avid what would be the benefit of iXML?
[Darren Roark] “Having been through this, the bean counters are going to eventually take notice that certain set in stone time consuming and labor intensive costly steps can be avoided with FCP X.”
Ehhhh….. how much input bean counters have really depends on the budget and the project. Back in the day, FCP Legend really won the hearts and minds of the documentary community because typically doc budgets are tight and the cost difference between FCP and Avid was in the 10’s of thousands of dollars. The cost savings was very big and very real. Today the cost difference between Avid, FCP X and PPro is pretty small and on projects with the budgets of Focus and Gone Girl the cost savings is trivial.
FCP Legend has always been less expensive than Avid yet Avid still remained the more used system in broadcast TV and film (at least in the US). If cost was always the deciding factor Avid would’ve closed up shop a long time ago.
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[Oliver Peters] “Merely reacting to the cheerleading tone. Goes against the grain.”
Amigo – what’s wrong with cheerleaders? I know a few. They’re really nice people. Healthy. Athletic.. Loyal as heck. The kind of people that when they’re around kinda make life less a drudgery and more a celebration!
Seems to me, cheerleading is, on balance, pretty positive. Our fans cheer when we try. The opponents cheerleaders go to work when they try. Whoever wins gets to celebrate, and whoever loses, hopefully, holds their heads up, re-commits to try harder next time, and pats the winning team on the back.
Sometimes the players screw up. Sometimes the coaches. Sometimes somebody makes an exceptional play and gets the glory. And sometimes theres’ a goat. It’s life after all. The Cheerleaders just keep the team motivated. Sounds pretty useful to me.
When you win – sure it’s fine to sit quietly by yourself and feel the warm glow of self satisfaction knowing that you weren’t wrong all along thinking that your team could play at a pro level.
BUT
The function of cheerleaders is that when the team works hard over the whole game or a whole season, – and gets a great result – there’s somebody prepared to help acknowledge the success of the efforts by helping to shape the celebration.
It’s kinda accepted practice, since it not only motivates the fans – but it’s just FUN.
(Remember fun? That elusive and hard to quantify thing that some X editors keep harping about???).
Without the cheerleaders, heck – we might as well be all watching golf!
(quietly tapping fingers to palm and whispering…)
“Jolly good show boys.” “Perhaps we can have another go after a spot of tea?”
Boring.
; )
(just having a silly bit of fun.)
Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.
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[Walter Soyka] “”I’m not seeing opportunities for freelance FCPX editors in my niche.”
“FCPX has a really strong toolset for creative/offline editorial.”
Maybe those could have lead to more meaningful discussion.”
Agreed, But that’s NEVER been the tone of the cold edge of the X opposition.
It’s always had a nasty undertow of aggrieved anger. The “Apple is an evil monster that gutted my expertise and left me no better off than my competition – how DARE they!!!”
If you think people have trashed my “X positive” rhetoric in the public forums, you should read some of the private correspondence I’ve had the past 4 years. There was some very real, deep seated HURT out there. And in fact, there still is.
Most of the truly professional forums have long since moved on to more rational discussions. But out in the cold cruel wider world, there are still people who truly feel that Apple created X just to screw up their personal chances at success.
It’s kinda spooky.
Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.
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[Simon Ubsdell] “Is it true to say that FCP X is so far superior to any other NLE that the editor’s actual experience becomes a distant second in the creative process?
That’s quite a claim.
“Simon,
I’ve never heard a single soul make that claim. What I HAVE heard, is that theres a small but growing sense among the Hollywood film community that there are ways to leverage new computer techniques to make the field-to-theater production experience more efficient and much more cost effective. Some happening regardless of a program like X, but others actually being driven by it’s database centric design.
When I was reading the stories about the workflow of Gone Girl, most of what I read about was the integration processes of After Effects and Premier in visualizing and delivering on the effects shots. That was the “this is better than what we were doing before” discussion. Which is great. Effects shots are important after all.
I suspect (we’ll know for sure next week) that a good bit of the allure of the FCP X workflow on Focus was eliminating duplicated effort by establishing a metadata workflow that started on-location and carried through into edit and then on into the mastering suite. It appears that the filmmakers were happy because they were able to see things sooner, see them more like what they would look like in the final movie – and that because the front end processes were made more efficient – they therefore felt they had more time on the back end to tinker with getting the edit the way they wanted it.
That same message has been articulated by Thomas Grove Carter on the Honda Other Side production pipeline, and Mike Matzdorff has eluded to it publicly in his very circumspect pre NDA lifting public discussions about Focus.
That conforms to what I and most X editors I know have experienced. Editing before X was typically a very different allocation of our editing time.
A bit more organizational time up front – but then BIG benefits when you’re actually assembling your master.
Again, we’ll know much more when these public discussions happen over the next few weeks.
But that’s my guess.
It’s certainly not that creative expertise is ever unimportant. Just that the individual editor who was tasked with making the ultimate decisions (individually or collaboratively) of what goes where and why – appears to have enjoyed doing it this way.
Remember Mike M was NOT an X fan before Focus. (I believe he starts his new book with that very stark admission!) But he clearly is now. And his job was getting the editing workflow dialed in in order to do the job.
To me, the amazing thing is that they got it done largely BEFORE the 10.1 Libraries revisions were even in place. Those early edit sessions must have been quite interesting!
FWIW.
Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.
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[Walter Soyka] “But I also think that FCP Legend editors tend not to think of all sortable columnar metadata that had been available to them — in part because the default size of the browser window hid them in list view mode.”
Perhaps, Walter.
But I think the more critical change is that for most editors, there was a perception that if you’re on a deadline of any sort, it’s ALWAYS much better to get clips on a timeline ASAP and start building scenes as soon as you can.
Collumnar metadata may or may not help, but establishing it was never the priority unless the individual editor made it so – and the system functioned just fine for any editor who just wanted to string out and cut and paste away.
In other words, it was VASTLY easier to ignore metadata in Legacy than it is in X. In X, it’s in your face at every turn. So you tend to think of it’s importance much differently.
I know it’s importance changed massively in my own thinking back when I started my transition from Legacy to X.
That was one of the most transformative parts of my personal switch.
FWIW.
Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.
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[Simon Ubsdell] “But maybe that’s were we’re headed – if so, please discuss as it’s genuinely fascinating, perhaps even more so than metadata :-)”
Sorry my friend, but I think you’re really stretching for this point.
Look at fine art. There are great masters, excellent fine artists, technical craftspeople, dilettantes and absolute hacks.
Editing is NO different.
If you’re looking for fine art for the wall of your modest living room – it might be “nice” to get a great work – but you’re likely going to have to settle for something less. And for the masses of movies being made, there will be some that require BRILLIANT editing and other movies that don’t. Christopher Nolan’s Memento was very nicely edited, but even if the cutting was 20% less precise the construction of the movie would still have carried the audience along.
And so I suspect it is with most movies.
Sure, sometimes an editor gets his or her hands on a piece of work and truly elevates it to something worth studying for decades to come. But mostly not. Even really good, popular and even loved movies don’t need every single cut examined and stressed over for weeks. They work just fine. So leave them along.
That doesn’t “devalue” editing. It just puts it in the same league as human endeavors like fine art. Lots of it should be created. Some should darn well be extraordinary. Hopefully the majority of it will be very professional and totally suite the project. And some will widely miss the mark and drag down whatever it’s attached to.
Same as it’s always been.
My 2 cents.
Know someone who teaches video editing in elementary school, high school or college? Tell them to check out http://www.StartEditingNow.com – video editing curriculum complete with licensed practice content.
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I was working with a producer of some fairly well known films recently making changes on a locked feature that was cut in FCP X. He said he didn’t want to work in anything else unless it had the post prep capabilities as FCP X.
FWIW, the prep lag between set and post that FCP X avoids is not going unnoticed.
I should have called ‘bean counters’ producers.
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