Help with P2CMS

[Gerret Warner]

I couldn’t agree more. The manual is indecipherable. At least you were able to figure out how to export to a targeted drive. Me, I’m still copying from locked P2 cards to my drives. Once they’re copied, I lock those files. Subsequent copies I continue to keep locked… and so far no files have been lost.

Still, with all the warnings against P2 ingest on Macs via Finder, I wish I could find a more foolproof workflow.

[Bob Woodhead]

P2CMS works fine, but I will STRONGLY (like REALLY STRONGLY) suggest you add Raylight to your P2 workflow. It seems like an option, but it’s not… Panasonic should buy Raylight & make it part of any P2 bundle, for those who edit on FCP. 2 reasons: metadata & direct use of MXF in FCP.

OK, P2CMS:
For verification, you need to enable a checkbox under the Options menu. It’ll add time to the transfer, but what a bad place to try to save time. What you’ll see when verification is On is during the Ingest, the progress bar will go from “copying” to “verifying” for each clip. Then to absolutely confirm your copy, the clip thumbnails will be overlaid with yellow, showing they’ve been ingested. You can ingest several cards, then put them back in, and as P2CMS reads the cards, the clips will appear with that yellow overlay, indicating they’ve been copied.

As for Lastclip.txt, honestly, I’ve never even thought about it, since I’ve always used P2CMS, and spanned clips just work.

On the Ingest question, that’s just your misunderstanding of P2CMS functionality. You create a database, Ingest MXFs into the database, then switch to Database mode & Search for what clip parameters you want to find. The Database MUST be searched in some manner in order to find & see clips. You can search on something as basic as clip video format, or if you use metadata, such as Project Name, that metadata will appear as a field in the search function.

My workflow:
1 – storage is external RAID 1 (2 mirror drives). RAID volume is named RAID 1 (RAID 2 , etc). Single P2CMS database on RAID, dbase name CAM_MASTER_1 (2, etc) – more on this later.
2 – shoot card(s), Ingest to database with verify On. Under Ingest there’s a checkboxs for “Sub Folder”; I use “Others” and type a shorthand project name; all clips will go into a database subfolder with that name.
3 – remove cards & re-insert cards, confirm all clips on card have yellow overlay to confirm transfer into database
4- reformat card(s) in camera
5 – done in the field
6 – copy that subfolder from above off RAID onto my edit storage
7 – RAID goes back into production bag for next shoot
8 – use Raylight to create QT Reference files (*not* QT self-contained files, as FCP does when importing P2). Using metadata, Raylight will automatically create clip names based on your metadata from shooting (eg; BRoll Take 2, OnCamera Take 1, etc… the Take #’s are incremented by the camera each time you hit record) These names show up in FCP. Other metadata fields can be used as well. LOVE THIS.
9 – Edit is done. Export either a self-contained full resolution QT from FCP timeline. Offload tape if needed by client.
10 – DELETE MXF files from online edit storage (remember, they’re on 2 separate drives in the field RAID)
11 – when field RAID is full, drives are databased in a standard database manner (not P2CMS) for offline searching. (client calls a year later & asks for something, a quick search & I know which of many drives, dvds, etc that file’s on). After databasing, both drives are removed, bagged in antistatic bags w/ desiccant, and put on shelf. Every 6 months I spin all drives sitting on the shelf.
12 – non-MXF project files usually small enough to burn to DVD for archival. DVDs databased as well.
13 – drink (good) beer

I’ve made other posts specifically about metadata workflow w/ FCP, do a search & you’ll find those either here or on DVXUser

“Constituo, ergo sum”

Bob Woodhead / Atlanta
http://www.CoolNewMedia.net
Quantel-Avid-FCP-3D-Crayola
Panasonic HPX500

[Bill Thomas]

Thanks Bob for that incredibly detailed description!

I need to reconsider my workflow options. Does editing straight from MXF files help data flow? In other words, would a native MXF file play more smoothly in a Sequence than an FCP-converted Quicktime?
And if FCP doesn’t create Quicktimes, I would assume it still needs to render certain files (transitions, etc.)?

If I saved a project as you said and brought it back a year later, I would need to re-render, correct? And what about other files used in an FCP project – animations, AE files, etc. I would need to find and back those up also.
Perhaps I could use Media Manager in FCP and create ALL files for future use. Then I’d be sure of a clean restore. Any thoughts?

Also, I was trying to find Raylight’s webpage but couldn’t. I found vendors selling it but no main page.

And most importantly, I read that it doesn’t work with Leopard yet – is this true? If so, I’ll have to wait!!

Thanks again Bob.

Bill

[Bob Woodhead]

I benefited greatly from some detailed explanations when I switched to P2, so the circle keeps going around. 😉

Raylight: https://dvfilm.com/raylight/mac/index.htm

>would a native MXF file play more smoothly in a Sequence than an FCP-converted Quicktime?< Nope, not to my experience or knowledge. >it still needs to render certain files (transitions, etc.)?< Yep. >brought it back a year later, I would need to re-render, correct?< Yep, assuming you haven't archived all the render files. I don't find it's necessary, as that can GREATLY increase your archive size (like if you color correct most of the sequence). Besides, all your settings are saved in the FCP sequence, so just let it render when you restore. >use Media Manager in FCP and create ALL files for future use< When I was still using tape, and had a project that had a good chance of re-opening in the future, yes, I'd use MediaMangler to create a "consolidated" (old Avid term, forget if FCP has a different one) archive with all media. But now with P2, and the "camera master" RAID drives, there's no need; just copy the RAID files back onto an edit drive & re-render. The RAID unit I have (ezRAID, 2 drive SATA FW800) copies 60GB in about 20 minutes. Heck of alot faster than loading tape! But sure, for a super-fast project re-load, you could consolidate, at the expense of archive storage space. >Leopard
Dunno, still Tiger here. Ask Support @ DVFilm

After all that info, last bit of workflow that I think is Best Practice, even though we’re not doing it. Instead of hard drives on a shelf (even though they’re mirrored, and spun up / accessed twice a year), it would be safer to store archive data on enterprise-class data tape like SDLT, LTO. These tapes have a 30-year shelf life! Most people will hesitate to think of leaving data on a drive on a shelf for beyond 5 years, even if they’re spun up occaisionally. But the best drive for the job (Quantuum SDLT-600A) is like $6,000 and impossible to find used. So….. drives on the shelf until we find a cheap, large, safe long-term storage method.

[Bob Woodhead]

The main benefits of using Raylight:
– no need to convert MXF to QT, MXFs are usable (almost) instantly in FCP
– metadata is available in FCP…. so nice to have clips “automatically” named when they’re imported. (not really automatic, as you have already set that data prior to shooting) And doing the “right thing” by utilizing metadata NOW when you shoot means it’s always there if you switch edit systems, or if FCP enables it directly
– Raylight will make a slate on frame 1 or 2 will ALL metadata visible
– you can write a clip (or sequence as a clip) back to a P2 card
– finally, though not supported by Raylight or Panasonic, I’ve found it possible to edit, on a MacBookPro, using the MXFs still ON THE CAMERA via USB. Scan the camera cards with Raylight, use the Raylight QT Ref files in FCP. Add effects, renders to local drive, then using Raylight, push the edit BACK TO a P2 card in the camera! Then take SDI out of the camera & playback! wow. I’ve sat in a satellite uplink truck & used this workflow. Quite the game-changer. Caveat: I have not tested different formats, just DV25 & DV50. I’ll try some HD formats today.

[Josh Wallace]

OK, P2CMS:
For verification, you need to enable a checkbox under the Options menu

Is that Tool>Option>Others and then where it says Compare, you tick the box for Export and it will verify the copy when it copies from a P2 Card to the Destination you have set?

Aah, think I just answered my own question. When you hit File>Export, you get some options there including Do you want to verify the copy. This is also where you set the Destination to Copy ( Export ) to.

Such a kooky program!! I think I’m starting to get it…