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Client complaining about ProRes
Where can I find information comparing 10-bit Uncompressed to ProRes? I have been using ProRes for a while now and I now have a client complaining that I used it on his last trailer. I’ve done film outs with ProRes and no complaints in the last few years. I’ve been looking online for something Graeme Nattress may have written but I have not found it.
Thanks!
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23 Replies
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Is your client complaining because he actually saw something wrong with the result, or is he simply a purist that demands the best based on some invisible theoretical advantage? In 99% of cases like this, you can set up a blind A/B comparison and prove that it’s a psychological barrier, not a physical limitation.
What was the original footage, video or film? How was it captured? What type of image processing has been done, i.e. has the footage been color graded? Is there a lot of compositing/vfx work in the trailer? It’s hard to tell if your client has a legitimate beef or if he’s merely a purist/snob.
In any case, ultimately it’s up to you to give the client what he asks for. If he demands Uncompressed 10-bit and he’s paying you, then you should give him what he wants.
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There was never any talk about what format I was using at the start of the job. The question came up when I delivered him a Quicktime and it was ProRes(HQ). I can redo the job by simply recapturing the footage of course.
The material is 60i DV footage mastered to HDCAMSR 23.98 422. He did not see any problem but he doesn’t want there to be any issue with the film out. I have been doing so many jobs in ProRes lately I did not think to ask. Most clients like to take home Quicktimes they can view on their home computer. I am going to capture similar clips and a/b them in Shake and even try some recompression examples.
It would be nice to point him to any other information online though too.
Thanks.
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I took a uncompressed HD national spot shot on film and re-compressed it to Prores HQ and then did a split screen for our Kona Lhe in FCP. I couldn’t see any difference to my eye. Not very scientific, but I was amazed to not see a difference.
Dajen Productions, Santa Barbara, CA
MacPro Two 2.8GHz Quad Core – AJA Kona LHe
FCS 3 OS X 10.6 QT 10 -
Shot on DV, scaled up to HD and he complains about ProRes! That’s too funny.
The only problem with a film out is the originating codec. DV is poor SD. You might get a better result staying SD (uncompressed is easy in SD)and playing out to digi beta. Then scaling up using a Teranex or similar hi qual hardware scaler to HDCam. The loss is in the DV plus scaling in FCP (if that is what your workflow was), not the HD codec.
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I think you need a new client!
Prores is an improvement over his DV originating format. If he doesn’t understand this,
you’ve got bigger problems ahead.mark
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Usually the material comes from film. In this case it comes from DV. He edits trailers for multiple clients. But I have done this before with film elements and finished in ProRes multiple times that have been filmed out and I have had not one problem in the past two years. I’m just looking for some information online to help make him feel better. I’m going to explain everything tomorrow.
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There is information in the Final Cut Pro Manual that’s quite good.
What exactly did the client see that they do not like. US Networks accept ProRes as an editing / deliverable codec. For Discovery Networks it is one of only three accepted codecs for their top tier, Gold, programming. It’s very clean and in my opinion completely imperceptible compared to 10bit.
If there is an issue, I would fully expect it is in a bad up-convert from DV to HD. Unless this conversion is done via a terranex, you are not going to get great results. We have tried both the Kona for DV upconversion and software upconversion. The Kona is decent, but the Terranex is much better for something as compressed as DV.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media“Foul Water, Fiery Serpent” now in Post.
Creative Cow Forum Host:
Apple Final Cut Pro, Apple Motion, Apple Color, AJA Kona, Business & Marketing, Maxx Digital. -
The film was mastered in another post-house. The conversion is quite good and does look like it was done with the Teranex. Knowing that US Networks and Discovery accept it is good fodder for a discussion. Thanks!
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The client isn’t complaining about anything they are seeing. They are just used to working on an “Uncompressed” environment.
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[Eugene Lehnert] “It would be nice to point him to any other information online though too. “
Eugene,
Do a google search for “ProRes a Closer Look”My article has been used as a reference on ProRes.
out of courtesy to the Cow I will not post web addresses that reside on competing sites.
gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows for the Digitally Inclined
Chicago, ILhttps://library.creativecow.net/articles/adcock_gary/AJAIOHD.php
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