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An NLE change from FCP poll results
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[Neil Goodman] “Trimming in X is one of its worst features, not like it was any good really in FCP 7 but thats one area they didnt improve on at all with X and i believe theyve backed themselves into a corner with the trackless timeline. I havent gotten a chance to get into PPRO 6 yet but if they copied Avids trim mode than all the better because it really is an elegant solution and you cant really argue its value. You can get in, make complicated trims across different tracks, slip, slide, and extend on stacks of video/audio and never have to touch the mouse.”
I find trimming X to be a fair bit better than in 7, and I think statements to the effect that it’s objectively worse than these other schemes are a little hard to buy. Keyboard control is not necessarily faster even if it feels that way — you have to actually measure to draw such conclusions. And the fact that FCP X’s trim tool lets you easily scrub the clips (including the presently unused segments of them) on both sides of an edit point before making an edit is a rather powerful feature.
I’m also really not quite sure why people keep insisting more keyboard-oriented trim features are somehow prevented by the magnetic timeline. There appears to be no real connection. Some details might have to be tweaked, of course.
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Digital Workflow/Colorist, Nice Dissolve.You should follow me on Twitter here. Or read our blog.
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[Shawn Miller] “Sure, Macs are more popular than they were before… that doesn’t change my point. Adobe is interested in creative professionals, PC and Mac users alike. You said that it was important to capture folks just entering the field… I agree. I think Adobe’s platform agnosticism and diverse product/capability offerings puts them in a better position to do that. “
I simply think that if you’re sitting there with a new Mac (and most folks in this industry, including those who are still just aspiring, do seem to use Macs), clicking a button in the Mac App Store and installing a slick self-contained app that performs the task you’re interested in learning how to do is a lot less daunting than signing up for an Adobe subscription plan, running what is, let’s face it, not one of the world’s better executed installation procedures, and ending up with half a dozen complicated and (and I mean this in the nicest possible terms, as a regular user of Adobe products) often fairly buggy products that sometimes make very questionable UI decisions.
It’s not perfect, but the car/truck analogy Jobs used to explain the relationship between the iPad and traditional PCs seems relevant. It’s honestly not easy to put into words, but FCP X feels to me like it’s part of the future of ‘lighter’, more focused computing, that emphasizes things like responsiveness and usability. As in other areas where such shifts are happening, some existing ‘power users’ are highly skeptical of the whole prospect. But I think it resonates with a lot of people. Sometimes less really is more, especially when you want your tools to stay out of the way of a creative process.
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Digital Workflow/Colorist, Nice Dissolve.You should follow me on Twitter here. Or read our blog.
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TL:DR – I like FCPX trimming its better than 7, I don’t care what you say, I’m not primarily an editor, I don’t understand how keyboard muscle memory works in this context, I’ve never used dynamic trimming anyway, or Avid.
https://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics
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[Craig Seeman] “Ahh, so the winner gets a system they can use FCPX on.”
LOL… Hey, I’m running MC 6.5 on a MB Air too, and I can run Pr on it as well.
As an aside… Just for giggles I DL’d trials of both MC and Pr. Hadn’t cut on Avid in a while, and never really used Pr, I figured I’d see where they were at. Gotta stay current right? 😉
MC has been easier for me to get back into the swing of, having used it for years in the past. I like the smart tools… And I realized FCP X Storyline editing feels very MC-like. Honestly… X is more like MC than Pr in a lot of ways.
Pr is way better than I remembered it being, based on my limited past experience. Very similar to FCP 7, for good or ill. Entirely too many buttons and disclosure triangles etc for my taste. This is true of all of ’em I guess, 7, MC, Pr…
The other thing those all have is tracks. Did I mentionI really hate tracks now? Having gotten fairly proficient cutting in X, I feel hamstrung on “traditional” NLE’s. Oh well…
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~”It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.”~
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I cant imagine its any faster with a mouse and it takesyou longer to click and drag to be exact. Having admitted your not familiar with Dynamic trimming your not really in a position to.comapre the two. Its almost night and day..
Neil Goodman: Editor of New Media Production – NBC/Universal
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[Chris Kenny] “I simply think that if you’re sitting there with a new Mac (and most folks in this industry, including those who are still just aspiring, do seem to use Macs),”
I think you may be overestimating the proportion of Mac users in the larger creative community (senior and aspiring). If there weren’t millions of folks doing creative work on Windows, there would be a lot less cross platform software.
[Chris Kenny] ” clicking a button in the Mac App Store and installing a slick self-contained app that performs the task you’re interested in learning how to do is a lot less daunting than signing up for an Adobe subscription plan…”
Perhaps, but (again) only if you’re on a Mac. My point continues to be that companies offering cross platform solutions have a greater chance of capturing and retaining new and aspiring artists. I see this with VFX, 3D and motion graphics artists especially, they seem to be much more platform agnostic than editors and graphic designers. Although, FCPX seems to have encouraged a number of editors to seriously explore other OS, software and hardware vendors.
[Chris Kenny] “….and ending up with half a dozen complicated and (and I mean this in the nicest possible terms, as a regular user of Adobe products…”
Adobe applications are complicated compared to…
[Chris Kenny] “….often fairly buggy products that sometimes make very questionable UI decisions.”
I guess this is a case of YMMV, I have multiple installations of the Creative Suite across a half dozen machines, and I’ve never had installation issues. All of my machines are also rock solid with very rare instances of crashing or instability (and I push these machines hard).
[Chris Kenny] “It’s not perfect, but the car/truck analogy Jobs used to explain the relationship between the iPad and traditional PCs seems relevant.”
What if you actually NEED a truck?
[Chris Kenny] ” FCP X feels to me like it’s part of the future of ‘lighter’, more focused computing, that emphasizes things like responsiveness and usability.”
I think this is subjective, plenty of people seem to be moving away from FCPX because of usability issues. Some switchers are even reporting that Edius is the most responsive NLE that they’ve ever used.
[Chris Kenny] “As in other areas where such shifts are happening, some existing ‘power users’ are highly skeptical of the whole prospect. But I think it resonates with a lot of people. Sometimes less really is more, especially when you want your tools to stay out of the way of a creative process.”
Let me ask you this then. Do you think that FCPX alone can meet the needs of an aspiring motion graphics or VFX artist?
Shawn
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[Shawn Miller] “What if you actually NEED a truck? “
I hate to belabor the point, but X *is* a truck, if you need it to be. This is not to say it does everything other NLE’s do. Yet. It’s a moving target, for better or worse.
[Shawn Miller] “plenty of people seem to be moving away from FCPX because of usability issues. “
Really? Other than UI responsiveness on my Mac Pro, now that I’ve used it for a while I find it to be extremely usable. And I use it in anger as Aindreas is fond of saying. 🙂 I’ve also noticed that the X UI responsiveness on my Macbook Air is way way better than on the Mac Pro I use at work. I’d guess that most “switchers” are running on towers as well. X, not surprisingly, seems to want a newer computer to run it’s best. FWIW, MC 6.5 is pretty snappy on the MB Air as well. 😉
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~”It is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.”~
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[Shawn Miller] “I think you may be overestimating the proportion of Mac users in the larger creative community (senior and aspiring). If there weren’t millions of folks doing creative work on Windows, there would be a lot less cross platform software.”
FCP is still, according to the SCRI survey over 50% of the NLE market, despite being Mac-only. And most of the Avid deployments I come into contact with are Mac-based as well. It doesn’t seem that implausible that the Mac is 75% or more of the video editing market.
[Shawn Miller] “Although, FCPX seems to have encouraged a number of editors to seriously explore other OS, software and hardware vendors.”
People constantly make statements like this here, but there is, as far as I’m aware, absolutely zero systematic data to show anything of the kind. Nor does it particularly make sense — there’s no reason for an NLE switch (evidence for which is also pretty thin on the ground) to entail a platform switch.
[Shawn Miller] “I guess this is a case of YMMV, I have multiple installations of the Creative Suite across a half dozen machines, and I’ve never had installation issues. All of my machines are also rock solid with very rare instances of crashing or instability (and I push these machines hard). “
Meh. There are entire web sites dedicated to gripes about Creative Suite. It’s very, very common to hear such complaints in venues where there isn’t active advocacy of Adobe’s products going on.
[Shawn Miller] “What if you actually NEED a truck? “
Then you use a truck. But in any given market, a majority of people don’t need that. And the analogy doesn’t entirely map, because higher end video workflows often involve the use of multiple tools, so you don’t necessarily need a ‘heavy’ tool that does everything. There’s a slightly more accurate if less accessible analogy — FCP X adopts the traditional Unix philosophy of building small, focused tools that do one thing well, and performing more complicated tasks by combining them.
[Shawn Miller] “I think this is subjective, plenty of people seem to be moving away from FCPX because of usability issues. “
Again, there’s no evidence for widespread switching at all. In the year or so after FCP X was released, Apple’s feature/broadcast NLE market share was down all of three percentage points. And we know that as of April of last year, there were more FCP X installs than FCP installs. It is not at all impossible that Apple has actually gained share in the overall NLE market. People can’t just keep using the assumption that Apple is losing users to justify their opinions about FCP X.
To address your point more directly, some people don’t like the magnetic timeline. This is a matter of personal preference; it’s not, strictly speaking, a ‘usability’ issue. There’s no general usability principle that prefers tracks over clips relationships or bins over metadata, and it’s not at all clear that the magnetic time e.g. makes editing tasks slower. The reverse may well be true.
[Shawn Miller] “Let me ask you this then. Do you think that FCPX alone can meet the needs of an aspiring motion graphics or VFX artist? “
No. Why should it?
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Digital Workflow/Colorist, Nice Dissolve.You should follow me on Twitter here. Or read our blog.
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[Neil Goodman] “I cant imagine its any faster with a mouse and it takesyou longer to click and drag to be exact. Having admitted your not familiar with Dynamic trimming your not really in a position to.comapre the two. Its almost night and day..”
It’s entirely possible that you’re right, but unless you’ve measured it, you really don’t know. You literally cannot determine which of two (small) UI interactions is faster via your own subjective experience. Your brain lies to you. This is not really a controversial opinion in the UX world.
For a very clear illustration of this, back when desktop computing platforms were still a big part of what people debated in platform wars, it was very common for Windows fans — who had presumably used Macs as well — to argue that in-window menu bars were superior because you didn’t have to move the mouse as far. In reality the Mac’s backstopped menu bar is, in testing dramatically faster. This is invisible in subjective experience — people’s reasoning about what should be faster combines with the brain’s inability to accurately measure small timespans, to cause people to experience what they expect, rather than what the clock shows.
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Digital Workflow/Colorist, Nice Dissolve.You should follow me on Twitter here. Or read our blog.
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[Charlie Austin] “[Shawn Miller] “What if you actually NEED a truck? ”
I hate to belabor the point, but X *is* a truck, if you need it to be. This is not to say it does everything other NLE’s do. Yet. It’s a moving target, for better or worse.”
I was referring to hardware… I thought that was what Chris was talking about. I don’t deny that FCPX is powerful.
[Charlie Austin] “[Shawn Miller] “plenty of people seem to be moving away from FCPX because of usability issues. ”
Really? Other than UI responsiveness on my Mac Pro, now that I’ve used it for a while I find it to be extremely usable. And I use it in anger as Aindreas is fond of saying. 🙂 I’ve also noticed that the X UI responsiveness on my Macbook Air is way way better than on the Mac Pro I use at work. I’d guess that most “switchers” are running on towers as well. X, not surprisingly, seems to want a newer computer to run it’s best. FWIW, MC 6.5 is pretty snappy on the MB Air as well. ;-)”
I wasn’t making the case that FCPX is not responsive. My point is that usability wise, some people find FCPX’s UI less desirable than a traditional NLE. Of course, I also think this is a completely subjective preference. People should use the applications that get them where they need to go with the least amount of angst. 🙂
Shawn
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