[Will Salley]

Thanks Dave, I wish it was as easy as that, but the files in the browser show the incorrect TC as well. I’m wondering if anyone has tried this using sound files from another device.

[Will Salley]

Another option -if you happen to have an external time code reader – is to send TC from the 702 to an audio track on the camera. In post, use the TC reader on the output of the audio track to display TC. I tested this with a Horita LTC/VITC reader and it works – but you would probably want to test it with your exact TC reader before the shoot.

[Will Salley]

[Matte Blume] “BUT, you DON’T WANT to take the timecode FROM the audio recorder to the camera for each take.
“

Yes you do! This is the only way to sync multiple takes correctly unless you use a time code slate and shoot it at the head or tail of each take.

The best method is to make a high-resolution bounce to your 702T or use the best source you have available – this will eventually become your master track. With time code now locked to audio, you can play this back on set while feeding camera(s) time code. They will be in slave mode and free-run. Every time you playback the 702T, the cameras will jam to the TC and, yes, it will repeat every time. In post, don’t worry about capturing via TC, just capture the entire tape or do a “capture now”. Also transfer the audio file from the 702 to FCP. You can use the original file as long as the sequence settings match the audio settings of the file; i.e.; 24-bit/96k. Now all you do is stack the takes on the timeline and use the time code overlays to sync them all – then use the multi-cam function to edit on the fly.
After its in the can, use the media manager to archive all the used footage and give it plenty of handle (about 6 secs). If you’ve got a spare drive, archive all the footage and project files.

If your cameras don”t accept external time code, use a time code slate or reader and shoot it at the beginning of each take, then use the visual TC to sync.

[Will Salley]

Pro Tools and probably Logic. I don’t know that Vegas is used all that much for post.

[Will Salley]

Close miking refers to the practice of positioning mics close to the sound source. This reduces the ambience of the room and audience – but – if you mic one instrument close, you have mic the others close, which means you will end up with a lot of mics on stage.

An alternative is to mic at a longer distance on some positions (sometimes called “field miking”). For instance, if you are limited to only six mic inputs on your 1402 mixer you might try the following:

1-directly in front of kick drum
2-drum overhead
3-directly in front of bass amp
4-off-stage in front to left
5-off-stage in front to right
6-house mic – hang from ceiling about half way back in room and ride fader during performance (use only if the room sounds good, if it’s too reflective or there’s too much crowd chatter, use this input for another low volume instrument).

If the band has a PA with an aux out, try sending all the vocal mics to one (or two) of the line inputs on your mixer – just be aware of line noise. Obviously, you would use just a hint of the signal from the kick and bass, and just slightly more on the overhead while using more of the off-stage mics panned hard left and right. Then send the output of your 1401 to the PD150 camera (line level, XLR>XLR).

Mic selection is, assuming you are using the band’s vocal and PA mics, a matter of what’s left. If you have a condenser, use it on the overhead. The others can be SM57 or 58 or an equivalent basic hand-held vocal mic.

The bottom line is that you need a balanced mix between all the instruments and vocals, and you don’t want all the room ambience that you would get if you simply stuck a pair of mics out in the audience. As someone mentioned earlier in the thread, think of the audio portion apart from the video first. Become friends with the band’s soundman – if they have one. If they don’t, hire one for the night, the live mix becomes your mix.

System Info – G5/Dual 2 – 10.4.8 – QT v7.1.3 – 8GB ram – Radeon 9800Pro – External SATA Raid – Decklink Extreme – Wacom 6×8

[Will Salley]

Since I do this for a living I guess I’ll chime in here – All the responses (so far) are accurate and are worth consideration. Recording a band in a live setting is something that takes many factors to come together, either by pre-planning or in many cases, pure luck. The more pre-planning and experience of those involved, the less “luck” needed to obtain an acceptable recording. Even if you don’t have a huge amount of gear you can get it done.

Your first, and probably most important decision is the VENUE. It’s amazing how many people try and record a live recording in a room that sounds bad and expect the result to be good! The optimum venue is a sound stage, which obviously is out of the question here. Try to arrange a venue that comes close:

-a naturally good sounding space (low ceilings, large area in front of stage, curtain behind stage or similar absorption) Stay away from narrow or wide rooms with limited distance to FOH, tall ceilings, highly reflective surfaces such as glass and mirrors.

Fortunately, the best rooms for live sound are usually also good for visuals.

The next step is to determine which method of tracking you can afford to utilise.

-Direct to camera – cheapest, but hardly ever successful
-Direct to two-track recorder from house mics – cheap, but usually better results because mics are arranged in a fixed, optimum position.
-close miking to mixer and then to camera – requires more equipment, but can provide exceptional results when done correctly. The key here is to isolate the mixing position far away from the performance so an accurate mix goes to tape.
-close miking to multitrack – By far, the best chance of getting something acceptable, but as you can guess, it takes a good bit of gear and setup for even the smallest of groups. You’ve also got to remember the additional task of a mixdown.

My suggestion would be the third option, close miking to mixer and then to camera, or better still, to a two-track recorder and the cameras. Use a traditional clapper slate to start and don’t let the cameras stop rolling. If they do, at least they will have the duplicated audio for reference (assuming you’re not using timecode). If you do this, make sure the mix is done and tested well before the show; sound checks are best. Listen to playback and make adjustments at that time. I use a truck and a very long audio snake to put the mixer in the truck and send it back to the recorders, I’ll often multi track and do a summed stereo mix to send to the cameras.

Here’s a shot of the setup- https://www.auralondesign.com/images/VanInt-1373.jpg

The second most important variable is the type of music being tracked. Acoustic jazz and bluegrass is easily recorded with just a single stereo mic placed in the sweet spot. Hard rock and pop is never easy. As a general rule of thumb, the louder the music is performed, the more difficult it is to capture correctly.

Good luck, I hope this helps.

[Will Salley]

[Naiche Lujan] “Also, on a side note, I have a cable that goes from XLR female to what looks like 1/8″ male, but it won’t fit in a 1/8″ jack. Upon closer inspection it looks a hair larger than the 1/8” male. Can anyone tell me what that is? “

Most probably it is a “TT” connector, also known as a “Bantam”, commonly used in recording studio patch-bays. It should be wired identically to a TRS 1/4″ connector.

[Will Salley]

I sometimes use the Bose QC-2’s for certain location situations. The most obvious use is when shooting process truck dialog where the mixer is in the truck and the actors are in the tow car. The headphones help reduce the drone of the truck cab while doing nothing to the signals from the talent mics. Other situations would be in, say, a hospital where noise control is impossible and the sound mixer can’t be in the same room with talent.

Be careful however; when using these headphones, make sure you are separated from the talent so their dialog will not be affected.

They also make good client/director cans.

[Will Salley]

The 302 should be at it’s default (0db) and the camera to -20db.

However, I use that same camera/mixer combination often and prefer the following settings:

Mixer: line level out with reference tone @ 0db
limiter on mixer is on with threshold set to +10db
Camera: line inputs @ -14db

What this accomplishes is a slightly higher signal between mixer and camera – with the drawback of more likelihood of clipping in camera – but the 302’s built-in limiter is far superior to the one in the 200. The worst part of the whole thing is the line delay in the headphone out of the 200, which needs to be monitored at all times.

[Will Salley]

I have to agree with you Roland, but with the exception of “specialty” shoots such as direct-to-tape music shows (where the audio will be re-mixed for audio only release,etc).

Also, that extra doubling of sampling frequency doesn’t buy you any extra headroom, it just helps the resolution of the audio. The extra 8-bits does, however, help with headroom but not as much as a good pre-amp in an outboard mixer (such as the 302). Actually, the mic pres in the 7-series are excellent, but the pre-amps in the 302 are almost as good and the built-in limiter is superb. Why go double-system unless an unusual camera/mixer link is necessary? It’s just adding an extra step in post.

System Info – G5/Dual 2 – 10.4.8 – QT v7.1.3 – 8GB ram – Radeon 9800Pro – External SATA Raid – Decklink Extreme – Wacom 6×8