John Heagy
Forum Replies Created
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I hole heartily agree with Evan on the negatives of the RAW/native workflow touted by Adobe. As the deadline nears is when you need the system to be fastest and get the product out without hassles. The time saved by not transcoding to a common codec will be forgotten. The issues and time required to render, with the deadline and impatient client looming, is what will be foremost. A common optimized codec will help with media playback and speed export. This is why Adobe’s lack of it’s own optimized codec is a big disadvantage for me.
We can take some time on the front end if it speeds up the back end. There’s rarely time to spare or patience toward the end of a project.
Apple and Avid would seem to agree on this point.
John
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[Juan Salvo] “You assume that Resolve is using QT APIs to decompress media.”
Not necessarily…
QT API calls and codecs can work independently. It’s very possible to use the QT API to locate and describe a ref movie and then use the codec separately, depending on the codec.
I believe one must use QT to decode ProRes unless Apple deems you worthy and provides the keys to AV Foundation.
John Heagy
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[Eric Johnson] “how much work could have been done on your DaVinci by exporting local files”
Thank you for the concern, but no loss of work has occurred. We’re in the early stages of integrating Resolve into our workflow.
[Eric Johnson] “it appears that you are fighting an uphill battle with something that doesn’t do what you want it to do.”
No battle has ensued, except with some who insist I should be happy with the Status Que. Believe me, if I settled for all the short comings and out right bugs I’ve encountered in apps we rely on… I’d be in a world of hurt. I’m prepared to lobby my case and, unless I get a definitive “no” from BMD, I can wait patiently for the fix/feature and work around it in the meantime.
If others have no need for ref movies then fine. Unless ref movie support in some way disrupts your workflow, I don’t understand the resistance here.
John Heagy
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[Juan Salvo] “Just use XML out of FCP. Resolve supports these.”
Yes that’s a great feature. But lets say I’m using the Calibrated or MXF4Mac QT components in order to use P2 or Sony .mxf media directly in FCP. That would not pass to Resolve in an xml because they both use ref movie tech to re-wrap the .mxf.
QT ref is a powerful tech, and given QT does all the heavy lifting, it should be supported by Resolve. Again, it may be that DaVinci did not intend to exclude it.
John Heagy
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[Juan Salvo] “P2 files… aren’t files but databases in a file folder structure. And they aren’t actually supported in Resolve. Resolve supports a specific list of media formats and containers.”
If you want to call xml files a database.. ok. I could say the same for QT ref. Semantics really.
[Juan Salvo] “https://blackmagic-design.com/media/2588311/davinci_resolve_8.2_supported_co…
You’ll notice reference movies aren’t on that list.”
That’s a list of codecs not file formats, thou .mov is listed many times under file ext. Like I said before, if an app supports .mov it normally supports referenced .mov. I’ve never seen it specifically excluded.
I’m surprised it doesn’t support P2. There are many formats that are essentially referenced formats that break video and audio into separate files, mxf included. This may be why Resolve doesn’t pass audio as it ignores the elemental audio files. That will be a problem if DaVinci decides to grant the much requested ability to pass audio in renders. Count me in wanting that BTW.
John Heagy
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[Joseph Owens] “A reference movie can and should contain everything that can be added to a Final Cut timeline — media, generators, transitions, filters, and a very long list of other things that are absolutely not going to fly in Resolve.”
Yes but filters, generators, etc all need to be rendered as QT files so not matter how complex the FCP timeline, it all ends up being a list of QT files wrapped up by a single ref file.
I can export a 2hr timeline as a QT ref file in seconds . It would take 1/2hr to flatten out the same to a self contained file. Not to mention the extra space required.
QT ref is a uniquely powerful feature of QT. Many are afraid to use it but it can turn processes that take hours into seconds. Take syncing picture to .wav. I can create hundreds of synced QT ref files representing many hours in less than a minute. The same process creating self contain QT would take many hours.
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[John Heagy] “We create files in one place and publish them out as ref movies keeping the originals safe and sound”
“[Eric Johnson] “I know this is not the answer you’re looking for, but If I understand the above sentence correctly, can’t you just give your DaVinci access to the location where your originals are?
“That’s one example of how we use ref movies. We also create original files as ref movies.
Everybody seems to think DaVinci excluded ref movies. Maybe, but until I here otherwise I see it as an unintended limitation that just needs to be fixed.
P2 files are referenced files and I assume they load in DaVinci.
John Heagy
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“John Heagy] “It would seem to be a easy fix as all the required paths are included in the ref movie. ”
[Juan Salvo]Yes, but Resolve doesn’t use these file paths. it uses it’s own relative paths that relate to the media pools available. That’s why I found it surprising that they work at all.”
Then It’s encouraging that a ref file with only a single referenced file works. If it was expecting the data in the ref file to be media, it would fail.
Resolve does “see” the correct duration, so it is respecting the .mov wrapper – now it just needs to look past the first referenced file to all the others and construct the entire file.
I’d love it if someone could confirm the single vs multiple reference file issue. My first post provides the simple instructions.
John Heagy
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“[Juan Salvo] “Ive never expected resolve to work with reference movies…”
[Joseph Owens] Me, either. The same with Apple COLOR…”
Ok, but I do. Reference movies are integral to our workflow plus they save us time and space. It does take some discipline to maintain the links but, with a large shared storage infrastructure, as long as the referenced files don’t move the ref movie will always work.
A self contained movie is no different than a ref movie except that it points to itself. This may be why a ref movie with a single referenced file works.
Given Resolve works with QT files I’m surprised it doesn’t work. Every app that I’ve encountered that supports QT files has never drawn a distinction between the two.
It would seem to be a easy fix as all the required paths are included in the ref movie.
John Heagy
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Ref movies are very important in our workflow. I allows us to move huge files virtually across our Xsan. We create files in one place and publish them out as ref movies keeping the originals safe and sound.
The files that do and don’t work in Resolve all open in other QT apps, so access to the referenced files is fine. The difference is that Resolve can’t “see” ref movies with multiple referenced files. They don’t load as offline but with black video in Resolve.
Thanks
John Heagy