Herb Sevush
22
COW Coins
20
Premiere Pro Coins
Forum Replies Created
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Chris –
That was very helpful in terms of explaining FCPX’s design philosophy. Of course it also makes it seem that it will never work for me.
The first thing I do once I’ve laid out a basic assembly of master shots with audio is de-link everything. I want total and absolute freedom of movement with every element I have, I want nothing connected.
While I need the ability to re-establish sync, easily accomplished in FCP7 with the sync indicators in the timeline, the idea that the software is trying to establish connections between elements is horrifying. The only connections that I want are in my perception of the elements.
For me the whole notion of B-roll and Master shot is ambiguous at best. My B-roll cutaway can extend past the underlying VO morphing into a new master shot using stolen sync I’ve cobbled together from an outtake. And once I’ve cut it this way I’m likely to want to unscramble it into a totally different pattern tomorrow. I couldn’t know I was going to do this before I did it, how could any software expect to organize that for me?
I had the same reaction to the whole notion of the software “intelligently” organizing shots into WS, 2 shots and CU’s. Who on earth would let software organize their footage. Organizing decisions are at the heart of the editing process, what third party is going to understand my specific working patterns without my input?
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions -
Nothing like a laugh first thing in the morning. Best post of the week.
Thanks.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions -
I’ve never found Chris to be nasty or rude, he’s entitled to his opinions. If you don’t like them, don’t read them.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions -
Indie features seem to overwhelmingly be on Final Cut these days.
I don’t doubt it. The Indie Film market is who FCPX was aimed at – because, generally speaking, their films will end up with a youtube release.
But let me put it another way – if you add up the salaries paid to all the editors working on Avids in feature films and broadcasting in New York, I think it would dwarf the income of the FCP crowd working in that market. How’s that for a condescending unprovable supposition.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions -
By what metric do they “rule”?
Look Chris, as I said I’m not that fond of Avid, but you’d have to be blind deaf and stupid, and I don’t think your the latter, not to notice that once you take the L train into the city, the overwhelming number of editing facilities catering to the broadcast market in NY are Avid based. If I were still a freelancer I would have to know how to cut on an Avid or else I’d starve. FCP was catching up, but if you don’t think this re-tooling isn’t going to grind that to a halt, there’s a big stone bridge I’d like to sell you.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions -
I thought the whole point you were making was that it wasn’t a rewrite from a user’s point of view….
Chris, now you’ve made a joke with some fine word play, good for you.
They’ve got an NLE that has lost market share continuously over the last decade
Well Apple has just reversed that trend.
largely because it’s interface — which they can never change very much because their existing users would flip out — is unappealing to new editors.
It was always unappealing to me. I used to edit on EMC, the original competitor to Avid, and then on discreet Edit*, my favorite all time NLE. If they had lasted and kept their basic interface I’d be happy as a clam. If Apple would have kept it’s interface i would have been happy as well. It isn’t the lack of change that makes their interface unpleasant, it’s always been more than a bit stodgy.
They’re also the last to go 64-bit, and even once they do, they’ll still be lagging Adobe and Apple with respect to other (frankly more important) technical features, such as GPU utilization.
This is where we fundamentally disagree – the phrase “(frankly more important) technical features.”
Again, it’s important to remember that the context of all this is FCPX’s suitability for the “pro” market, and by that I mean broadcast / film. After all that’s who’s on this forum.
For me, and many others here, technical features are not more important than consistency, dependability under pressure, and the ability to play nicely with others. I need things to work, I want them to work fast. To paraphrase – You can’t always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find you get what you need — such as multi-cam and backwards compatibility. I’ll get that from Avid. Which is why they still rule the roost in this area, declining market share, stodgy interface and all.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions -
No. People keep saying this… Adobe did not rewrite Premiere to make it 64-bit.
People don’t say this, Adobe calls it a re-write. And while it may not be a re-write from a programmers point of view, it was a re-write from a user’s point of view.
And while this is purely speculation on my part, my guess is Avid will keep their user base in mind when they do whatever-it-is-you-want-to-call-it in the future.
They’ve stopped selling new copies. This is not the same thing as EOLing “all support”, or disbanding the maintenance team. Do you have a source that claims they’ve done the latter?
No. Do you have a source that claims they haven’t? I’m not asking that facetiously, it would be very reassuring to think that they will actually do FCP maintenance upgrades for Lion. I could wait even longer to switch. That would be good news indeed.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions -
“You’re simply playing word games here. A rewrite is “an entirely new app”.”
I’m not playing word games I’m simply using words precisely. Adobe did a total 64 bit re-write on Premiere Pro and it was most definitely NOT “an entirely new ap.” When Avid does it’s re-write I will bet your bottom dollar that it will not be “an entirely new app.” 2 years ago when editors were worried that Apple was deserting them they had this exact scenario in mind – that FCP was going to be EOL’d. Well it has absolutely come true. And this is irrespective of whether or not FCPX proves to be the greatest editing ap of all. There is no practical difference to me between migrating to Avid or FCPX – (other than it’s probably a little easier to bring up legacy files in Avid.)
They could have created an app that was more compatible… by declining to implement what they believed was an extremely compelling new approach to handling sequences
And again you show your lack of appreciation for backward compatibility. The fact that Apple doesn’t see the value of it is what troubles me.
My guess is FCS3 requires third-party licensing that Apple doesn’t want to continue paying.
Yes, so screw ’em.
I simply think that, having promised that FCP 7 will work on Lion, Apple will fix any such issues
How? They’ve EOL’d all support for FCP7. Who’s left to work on it? I didn’t hear them guaranteeing to fix anything – they simply said that FCP& will “work” on Lion. If it crashes more often, if something like the screwed up “gap” command happens – that doesn’t mean it’s not “working.” It’s just not working well. I also haven’t heard AJA or Blackmagic say they’re making drivers for an EOL’d system, have you. I don’t think Apple’s too worried about law suits here.
They were worried when they announced that they would continue to sell FCP7 licenses to facilities that already had volume licenses though. You could see the lawyers handwriting all over that one. Of course that doesn’t mean they’re willing to sell a license to someone like me, that would show actual concern, and they don’t have to worry about lawyers in my case, so screw ’em.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions -
My guess is at least half of the people who own PP don’t even use it, it’s just a throw in to them when they get Creative Suite for Photoshop & AE.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions -
From the Apple FCPX FAQ: “……… Final Cut Pro 7 will work with Mac OS X Lion”.
Yes, and because Apple says it, on paper even, it must be true. FCP7 will “work” with Lion the way Democrats “work” with Republicans in congress. And when all the users start complaining about buggy behavior, Apple can say “well it worked on the one work station in the back room we tried it on.” Oh wait, they won’t even say that, because, as you know, there no longer is any FCP7 support.
NO operating system upgrade has ever worked right off the bat with FCP without problems. And what about your I/O drivers. Do you think AJA and Blackmagic are busy writing Lion drivers for an EOL’d editor. I don’t. And even the Apple FAQ didn’t say they were. And as you know, everything Apple says is true. And that goes double for what they don’t say.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions