Chuck Mcmakin
Forum Replies Created
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And now the question becomes… “Which storage solution providers have the expertise to help their clients with these new XSAN installs and ongoing support???”
Will Apple continue to sell XSAN support? The support sku is still on the web store today for $799 (and that’s PER SEAT folks!)
Anybody thinking they will be getting “free” help from Apple with a new XSAN install is likely to be in for a bit of a rude awakening. You going to drag your entire XSAN up to the “Genius Bar”? Good luck with that!
Now that it seems nobody will need an XSAN medallion to resell the product (which involved an authorized reseller’s requirement to participate in Apple’s associated product training), the differences regarding service and support from your hardware & software vendors become an even more critical factor than ever.
So… yes it is exciting that XSAN is being released into the wild. Sadly, this turn of events also means there will be dozens (if not hundreds) of lesser experienced storage chop-shops trying to sell XSAN on the cheap with little to no support… Caveat emptor!
Chuck McMakin
JMR Electronics, Inc. /
Phone: (818) 993-4801 x136 /
Email: chuckm@jmr.com -
Hi Alex.
As it seems you are aware, there are several possible ways to share storage for a post workflow, all with differing features, benefits and challenges.
Here at JMR we typically begin our discussions with any new clients by making sure we understand our client’s expectations and requirements when it comes to “sharing”. The differences between just being able to access and quickly copy over footage to a local workstation as needed versus accessing the same footage for multiple editors in real time can amount to big differences in your ultimate equipment and software costs.
JMR’s solutions are designed with an open systems approach. We recommend using caution when considering offerings from some vendors which will “lock you in” with their hardware. If expanding the storage requires you to go back to that same vendor, you may seriously regret that purchase down the road…
If performance is an issue (and with HD workflows, it usually is), you will most likely find that fibre infrastructure offers one of the better values today. JMR’s fibre based storage (we call it the BlueStor FibreStream) even offers a built-in 4-port fibre switch, which sounds perfect for your near term needs.
Please feel free to contact us any time if you would like to discuss your situation further. We are always happy to talk with you about how we can help you optimize your workflow!
Chuck McMakin
JMR Electronics, Inc. /
Phone: (818) 993-4801 x136 /
Email: chuckm@jmr.com -
Hi John.
CommandSoft has been in ongoing recent discussions together with your vendor about the issues you have reported.
I believe that discussions between senior engineers with both companies took place as recently as last Friday night.
I can assure you that neither CommandSoft nor your vendor have given up on helping you to resolve the issues.
I certainly understand that the unusual and ongoing challenges you’ve experienced have been frustrating. That being said, both CommandSoft and your vendor do also have many successful SAN installs together. It isn’t a matter of either company being new to the market or anything like that… I suspect you care less about that though, and more about just what it’s going to take to get your SAN working perfectly.
I am very confident that the appropriate attention by the engineers from all companies now involved will result in our being able to successfully isolate and resolve the problems specific to your SAN.
These troubleshooting challenges sometimes take longer than any of us would prefer but that is also a part of the nature of supporting an open architecture solution that has so many variables in the equation.
Please feel free to contact me directly if you ever feel that you aren’t getting the responsiveness you expect.
Chuck McMakin
CommandSoft, Inc. /
Phone: (805)730-7772 /
Email: chuck@commandsoft.com -
Hello Ramy.
Yes, it most certainly is possible to have shared storage solutions for workflows that include FCP, Avid & Pro Tools. Since the nature of audio and video editing does differ somewhat as far as disk access is concerned (Pro Tools does LOTS of very small reads & writes very quickly) we would usually see the specific physical devices devoted to audio or devoted to video but ther is no reason they can not both be shared to the same sets of editors via a common fibre channel interface.
CommandSoft’s partners over at Rorke Data have a great deal of experience in these combined workflows.
Please feel free to call on either of us if you would like to discuss your needs in greater detail.
Chuck McMakin
CommandSoft, Inc. /
Phone: (805)730-7772 /
Email: chuck@commandsoft.com -
Hi there Jaime.
It all comes down to your workflow.
Depending on the resolutions and numbers of video streams with which you are working at any given workstation, you may find that a single “pipe” between that workstation and the switch is sufficient.
Likewise, for higher resolution video streams, piping several of them to one workstation will eventually saturate your 2Gb/4Gb/8Gb pipeline such that you simply MUST add more fibre ports before that workstation could take in or output all of the data with which you are trying to work.
In my real world experience, single port 4Gb HBAs are plentiful, dual ported HBAs are also fairly common to see in use and quad port HBAs a bit more rare (since few workflows require that much data to one workstation).
Obviously, the smart money is to think far enough ahead with your planned jobs such that you don’t regret buying a single port HBA because you suddenly find you need a “fatter pipe” to it a couple weeks down the road.
Feel free to contact us at CommandSoft if you would like to discuss your workflow further and we can try to provide the appropriate advice.
Chuck McMakin
CommandSoft, Inc. /
Phone: (805)730-7772 /
Email: chuck@commandsoft.com -
Hi Spencer.
Since a couple of our most experienced and knowledgeable customers and partners have chimed in for you already (thanks for the kind words folks!), I’ll simply add that we here at CommandSoft also welcome you to contact us any time if you have additional questions or concerns.
Be wary of working with any vendors that don’t start their discussions with you by focusing on questions about your workflow wants, needs and desires. As Mr. Zelin has pointed out here and many times before, there are lots of hardware vendors out there but only a small few that truly understand the needs of digital post workflows.
We look forward to hearing from you.
Chuck McMakin
CommandSoft, Inc. /
Phone: (805)730-7772 /
Email: chuck@commandsoft.com -
Hi Oren and welcome!
CommandSoft typically addresses the question you have posed by recommending that we have a slightly deeper discussion together about the resolutions and numbers of video and/or audio streams that you anticipate needing your storage to support.
Each storage vendor’s hardware will have differing performance characteristics so the best way to “right size” your solution is to define your bandwidth requirements up-front to your potential storage vendors. I notice you didn’t really even state a target overall storage capacity so I think you realize that available capacity should be your secondary consideration after performance.
Your post mentioned 4 gfx/edit bays but not exactly how many streams each editor is likely to work with simultaneously. I am guessing that may mean you only need 1 stream per edit bay, but we always ask to be sure…
To help illustrate why that info is important to us, take this example:
One of CommandSoft’s more popular 16-bay RAID arrays is capable of supporting about 16 simultaneous DVCPROHD streams. That could be mapped out as 4 streams to each of the 4 edit bays or two streams each to as many as 8 edit bays, or… you get the idea.Not sure precisely what your flash animators will need as far as bandwidth goes but it shouldn’t be too hard to figure out.
Your Photoshop crew probably won’t need the same performance levels as your NLE and flash teams but the workload they put on the SAN could still potentially impact performance if we aren’t careful so it is good to factor them in too, just as you have.
With a FibreJet SAN you really only need:
Any storage array that uses an industry standard HFS/HFS+, NTFS, or FAT32 file system. (Of course the storage needs to be compatible with your choice of fabric/network infrastructure.)
A fabric/network switch (either fibre channel, GigE, or 10GigE)
HBAs (of the appropriate infrastructure type to support the switch & storage choices)
and SAN management software (the best of which is our FibreJet, of course!) 😉Please feel free to call us any time if you would like to discuss your project further. We are always happy to help.
Chuck McMakin
CommandSoft, Inc. /
Phone: (805)730-7772 /
Email: chuck@commandsoft.com -
Hi Simon.
We’ve tested both Rorke Data’s and Enhance Technology’s RAID arrays with FibreJet here in our lab at CommandSoft.
To support the streams you are describing you need to apply more spindles to the workload.
Depending on the vintage of 16-bay Rorke chassis you have, you may be able to add a SAS JBOD expansion chassis but you would probably still have to be willing to reconfigure the existing storage in order to optimize the throughput. Rorke says that the 16-bay chassis with the expansion chassis will support 4 10-bit HD 1080P streams or 4 x 2K streams in that combination.
Otherwise, if you simply invest in another 16-bay, single controller 4 Gb chassis, you should still be able to get 2 10-bit HD 1080P streams or a single 2K stream from one system.
Please do note that I’ve stated “or” not 2 1080P streams “and” a 2K stream.
It’s all about the spindle count and the efficiencies of the RAID controllers.
Fortunately for you, choosing FibreJet as your SAN manager gives you a transport-independent solution. This empowers you to choose whichever storage offers you your best value while remaining comfortable that the FibreJet software won’t ever get in the way of realizing maximium performance available from your choice in hardware.
Feel free to contact us directly if you have additional questions.
Chuck McMakin
CommandSoft, Inc. /
Phone: (805)730-7772 /
Email: chuck@commandsoft.com -
Yeah, I think we all see our fair share of inquiries from folks that aren’t actually in the market for professional solutions. (Not sure if that’s necessarily true with our OP in this case or not…)
We do try not to seize every forum posting as an opportunity to reply with an “infomercial” response but… we’re also all just trying to spread the SAN love, ya know? 🙂
Chuck McMakin
CommandSoft, Inc. /
Phone: (805)730-7772 /
Email: chuck@commandsoft.com -
Hi Chris. No disrespect taken.
We appreciate your confidence in our statements about how well FibreJet works for Avid workflows. It is true that we have learned a lot about real-world workflows by virtue of the good fortune we have had in providing solutions to several of the bigger studios and networks.
..but that isn’t the only segment of the market in which FibreJet SANs are viable!
Of course we understand that the total expense of the SAN (SAN client software included) needs to be taken into consideration, especially when we are talking about smaller shops and especially in such trying financial times. (Although I should mention that we have leasing companies constantly calling on us saying they are cash flush and ready to write deals into digital post opps.)
I can’t help but wonder if you are probably not aware that CommandSoft also offers iSCSI versions of FibreJet at less than half the cost of the versions for fibre channel infrastructure?
Using an iSCSI approach can help keep cost of both the hardware and the SAN clients down to a much easier-to-handle price point for some of the smaller shops.
We aren’t trying to say we are the only game in town that works. We’re simply requesting that you not write us off due to an outdated assumption about total cost. Our success in larger facilities has helped us continue to improve and innovate while also enabling us to push into more cost-sensitive markets.
Feel free to give us a call any time. We have a pretty generous evaluation policy for anybody interested in giving FibreJet a test flight.
Chuck McMakin
CommandSoft, Inc. /
Phone: (805)730-7772 /
Email: chuck@commandsoft.com