thanks for the link, i’ve sent the tutorial before but i didn’t think to use particle world in it because i was taking a bit of inspiration from his speed particles tutorial or something, because i liked the look that the particles in particular give off wiht motion blur etc, ive mamaged to come up witha basic system using his 3d orbit preset and a bit of rotation applied to the emitter randomly, and also using child particles, but thanks anyway ill refresh my memory and see if i can gte the particles in cc particle world looking better 🙂 much appreciated!