Welcome Shane From Outside USA

[Barry Green]

Hey Jan, that’s not what he was asking. He was asking for DVCPRO-HD at 25fps, not at 25 megabits. Uli’s European, and Apple doesn’t support 720/25p or 720/50p yet.

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Get the most from your DVX camera. The DVX Book and DVX DVD are now available on ebay and at Amazon (https://www.fiftv.com/db)

[Uli Plank]

Sorry, Jan,

that wasn’t me 😉

Uli

Author of “DVDs gestalten und produzieren”, a book on professional DVD-authoring in German.

[Jan Crittenden livingston]

[Barry Green] “Hey Jan, that’s not what he was asking. He was asking for DVCPRO-HD at 25fps, not at 25 megabits.”

Okay, so maybe I didn’t have enough coffee when I wrote the first response, and said Uli wrote it, but it was Toke, but your explanation of what he meant doesn’t make much sense either, sense we do make DVCPRO HD at 25P/720 in the HVX.

SO when Toke comes back we’ll find out.

Thanks,

Jan

Jan Crittenden Livingston
Product Manager, DVCPRO, DVCPRO50, AG-DVX100
Panasonic Broadcast & TV Systems

[Barry Green]

You’re right, I blew it! Sorry Uli, it was Toke as Jan said…

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Get the most from your DVX camera. The DVX Book and DVX DVD are now available on ebay and at Amazon (https://www.fiftv.com/db)

[Toke]

Ok, I’ll ask again:
why panasonic chose not to develop quicktime codecs for dvcprohd@25fps & @50fps to be used with NLE’s like FCP in Europe?
If you would offer those codecs, people in Europe could buy your cameras. Now they don’t (at least as much) because lack of codecs cripples hvx badly.

[Gary Adcock]

[toke lahti] “Ok, I’ll ask again: why panasonic chose not to develop quicktime codecs for dvcprohd@25fps & @50fps to be used with NLE’s like FCP in Europe? If you would offer those codecs, people in Europe could buy your cameras. Now they don’t (at least as much) because lack of codecs cripples hvx badly.”

Toke
you keep getting the same answer every time you ask this (this being the 3rd or 4th time I have answered)

Asking Panasonic to write code for Apple is a tad foolish don’t you think? Apple writes the code for it’s application even for the FRC plug in for Final Cut Pro.

The codecs are there. Just because Apple did not implement them for FCP, does not mean they are in use everyday around the world in the cameras and with other edit systems.

The DVCPROHD codec is only for 100mbps data,
The DVC/PRO ( DV25) and (DV50) SD codecs work just fine in FCP at both 25p / 50i have been in use for a number of years all over the world.

Just because Apple does not currently support 720 @ 25p/50i does not make it Panasonic’s fault.

gary adcock
Studio37
HD & Film Consultation
Post and Production Workflows
Chicago, IL
gary@studio37.com

[Jan Crittenden livingston]

[toke lahti] “why panasonic chose not to develop quicktime codecs for dvcprohd@25fps & @50fps to be used with NLE’s like FCP in Europe?”

Hi Toke,

It is because we don’t write software, the guys that have to write the support codecs are the NLE guys. Sorry to say but if it is going to work with the NLEs, they have to write it.

Best,

Jan

Jan Crittenden Livingston
Product Manager, DVCPRO, DVCPRO50, AG-DVX100
Panasonic Broadcast & TV Systems

[Toke]

I’m sorry to hear this attitude from Panasonic; it’s like saying “we don’t care if you’re not getting support from apple, we won’t give that to you.”

Even small companies like BitJazz(SheerVideo) have made very nice codecs for QT that can be used very fluently in FCP.
So Panasonic would have muscle to produce the software for European mac users (like you produced P2 Wiever for windows users), but you chose not to do that.
Maybe you know then why dvcprohd isn’t so successful in Europe and you accept it.
And maybe apple has 720p codecs “in the works” and they will announce them before first products that uses it have been less than two years in the market.

Meantime Panasonic Europe’s support and service keeps surprising me.
Now, I got an answer after three weeks that the employee that I e-mailed has been sick ever since.
What kind of support does not forward e-mails of a employee to others that are not sick?
How basic these things are?

[Toke]

[gary adcock] “Toke
you keep getting the same answer every time you ask this (this being the 3rd or 4th time I have answered)
Asking Panasonic to write code for Apple is a tad foolish don’t you think? Apple writes the code for it’s application even for the FRC plug in for Final Cut Pro.
The codecs are there. Just because Apple did not implement them for FCP, does not mean they are in use everyday around the world in the cameras and with other edit systems.
The DVCPROHD codec is only for 100mbps data,
The DVC/PRO ( DV25) and (DV50) SD codecs work just fine in FCP at both 25p / 50i have been in use for a number of years all over the world.
Just because Apple does not currently support 720 @ 25p/50i does not make it Panasonic’s fault.
“

Sorry for repeating this question, I only repeated it, because Jan asked for it.
Asking hardware providers to support their hardware by offering drivers for their products (this time codecs) isn’t very foolish don’t you think?
Would you buy a printer without a driver for your system?
Well, I was foolish enough to buy a camera…

In the past, when cameras used just one codec, it wasn’t so necessary for camera manufacturer to release “drivers” (=codecs) for every model, since the NLEs usually supported the cameras already. Things have changed since. Today it seems a bit awkward to ask NLE producer to support every camera model, when each of them can have several unique codecs. I’d say that it is camera manufacturer’s responsibility to make sure that the product has a feasible workflow.

The codecs are there?
Well, 720p25 or 720p50 are not there (or at least here)!
And we all know that these are the sweet recording modes for hvx right now.
1080p gives only minimal increase to resolution and since we can’t get 8GB p2 cards over here, 4GB card’s limited recording time really cripples the camera.
And since there’s little use for 4GB cards, there’s no sense to buy a lot of them, since their value will drop near zero when 8GB cards will be available and 720p codecs are not.
And the other alternative to shoot SD isn’t very attractive either. Why buy hd camera with variable frame rates, if you can’t use them?
I bet that if there were a poll among US hvx users, 90% of footage is shot in 720p. 720PN is just the sweet spot for this camera with present p2 card prices (even if 8GB cards are widerly available in US).

I have a shooting next saturday, where variable framerates would be essential and man, I hate to do this, but I don’t see any other way than shooting 720p and dubbing to dv-tape. Goodbye to hd and tapeless workflow…

[Jan Crittenden livingston]

toke lahti>I’m sorry to hear this attitude from Panasonic; it’s like saying “we don’t care if you’re not getting support from apple, we won’t give that to you.”

Toke, this is not what I said and frankly I am a little irritated that you have decided to obscur my words. What I said was we do not write code, we do not know how to make a Quicktime codec to work in Apple. Apple is working on this, I believe that has been stated in one of these posts. Apple is a valued partner and they are working on it. We are not a small company that writes software for a living, like bitjazz. Why doesn’t BitJazz make a camcorder? We are a hardware company. Please do not contrue my words again.

Thank you,

Jan

Jan Crittenden Livingston
Product Manager, DVCPRO, DVCPRO50, AG-DVX100
Panasonic Broadcast & TV Systems