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The New Mac
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That’s true. But Pro environments have been dealing with keeping the hardware “out of sight, out of mind” for years now. In a real client oriented suite, all the real gear is hidden away save monitors, keyboard and any other control surfaces.
And thankfully the price on TB cables has come down. A 2m cable is 40 bucks, which easily gets the peripherals into a soundproof/vented box, or thru the a wall into an equipment room. And let’s not forget you don’t need a long cable for every external device; only devices that eat the bandwidth on a controller [a RedRocket card], or when you reach your maximum chain length of 6 devices. Right now a short .5m cable still costs you $30. I hope we’ll see even shorter lengths at presumably lower prices for daisy-chaining. Like Elgato’s 1.5ft cable but for $15-$20.
As I’ve been saying elsewhere, I think the flip-side to the cabling issue is that every user gets the raw horsepower in the MacPro- whether they need very little expansion (video I/O and external storage), or they have 36 TB peripherals and max out the ports.
And while it would be great for TB2 to be able to support 16x PCIe cards, with the GPUs internal, I’m not sure I see what other cards need that kind of bandwidth.
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In the old MacPro, after adding a 2nd GPU to match the new MacPro, you have 2 4x PCIe slots. Additionally you have internal HDDs which will now have to be external. That’s adding 3 things.
Unlike the old MacPro those three Thunderbolt things you add, can also be moved to any other current Mac with Thunderbolt as needed.
Unlike the old MacPro, with 6 Thunderbolt ports you can add several other Thunderbolt devices.
While you certainly may disagree, I suspect many potential customers will appreciate the interchangeability with other Macs as well as the increased expandability.
Thinks might be slightly more inconvenient in making the two PCIe slots along with the drives external but the advantages probably outweigh the disadvantages for more.
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[Marcus Moore] “That’s true. But Pro environments have been dealing with keeping the hardware “out of sight, out of mind” for years now. In a real client oriented suite, all the real gear is hidden away save monitors, keyboard and any other control surfaces.”
“And at just 9.9 inches tall with a diameter of just 6.6 inches, it’s a pro desktop computer that can actually sit on your desk.” – that’s Apple’s marketing description – doesn’t sound like a machine room type of computer to me. Everything about the R2MP is about having it on the desktop – it’s not rack-mounted, it swivels to reveal the i/o ports – why have a snazy design if your sticking it in a back room? Apple designed this for the desktop – where you or I might want to put it is another matter.
[Marcus Moore] “As I’ve been saying elsewhere, I think the flip-side to the cabling issue is that every user gets the raw horsepower in the MacPro- whether they need very little expansion (video I/O and external storage), or they have 36 TB peripherals and max out the ports.”
Agreed. In that way it’s similar to X – Apple supplies the minimum configuration and third parties supply the options for the power users.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
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nothin’ attached to nothin’
“Deciding the spine is the process of editing” F. Bieberkopf -
[Craig Seeman] “Unlike the old MacPro those three Thunderbolt things you add, can also be moved to any other current Mac with Thunderbolt as needed. “
That’s nice, but my edit room isn’t set up that way. Other than a DVD burner everything else – Raids, i/o cards, monitors – are needed by each machine at all times – sharing doesn’t enter into it.
[Craig Seeman] “Unlike the old MacPro, with 6 Thunderbolt ports you can add several other Thunderbolt devices.”
This is like the X straw man argument whereby you compare X to Legend. Of course the r2MPro is better than the old MacPro. The question is whether it’s better than the Dell 7600 or whether it’s the optimal design for the new MPro.
[Craig Seeman] “Thinks might be slightly more inconvenient in making the two PCIe slots along with the drives external but the advantages probably outweigh the disadvantages for more.”
If the price is right it could appeal to more customers overall at the cost of losing some of the high end workstation users, which seems to be in line with Apple’s overall strategy.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
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nothin’ attached to nothin’
“Deciding the spine is the process of editing” F. Bieberkopf -
[Herb Sevush] “If the price is right it could appeal to more customers overall at the cost of losing some of the high end workstation users, which seems to be in line with Apple’s overall strategy.”
Do you mean losing high end workstation users who are fixated on cables? 😉
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And to take it farther how did all you cable challenged pros deal with all the plethora of audio and video cables we used to have going every which way. I still have a lot of that snaking around.
And clients are constantly bringing in hard drives withe content to copy or use. Lately, I’ve been working off of daisy chained FW800 portable drives in FCPX because I don’t have time to copy the content over to my dedicated array.
Anyone who is all that concerned about cabling is probably in the wrong profession.
As far as I can see I will have less base cabling with the new MacPro and Thunderbolt peripherals. So it isn’t the case that all pros will have more cabling.
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[Herb Sevush] “That’s nice, but my edit room isn’t set up that way. Other than a DVD burner everything else – Raids, i/o cards, monitors – are needed by each machine at all times – sharing doesn’t enter into it.”
Granted there are plenty who are tied down like that but, just my hunch, there’s an increasing number of people who need to (or would like to) move peripherals around.
[Herb Sevush] “The question is whether it’s better than the Dell 7600 or whether it’s the optimal design for the new MPro.”
It depends on how many 4x PCIe slots you need vs what 6 TB can handle.
Apple probably is aiming to increase MacPro sales with their new design and specs and my guess is they’ll probably reach more people with the Tube then a traditional desktop. Sure it wont suit some people but there are many more who would consider this given the size and interchangeability of Thunderbolt.
[Herb Sevush] “If the price is right it could appeal to more customers overall at the cost of losing some of the high end workstation users, which seems to be in line with Apple’s overall strategy.”
Yes Apple is becoming a “commodity” company.. I think some people are seeing it’s not “consumer” vs abandoned “pro” but how to make formerly Pro limited devices more appealing to wider markets. There’s certainly up and downside to this but Apple is banking on the upside leading in increased sales and/or increased margins.
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I was hoping the new mac pro would be modular along these lines. Give each customer what they need and allow them to add on as the need changes. I was also hoping the new OS would be a sequential number and/or date so i knew intuitively which OS came out when and in what order. Mavericks is a ridiculous name for one of the the most recognized brands in history.
But bottom line, I’ll be happy if the new configuration is reasonably priced when all is said and done.
Mac Pro, macbook pro, Imacs (i7); Camcorders: Panasonic AG-HPX170/AG-HPX250P, Canon HV30/40, Sony Z7U, VX2000, PD170; FCP 6 certified; write professionally for a variety of media; teach video production in L.A.
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Agreed- Apple is positioning the MacPro to sit on the desk. I guess I meant to say all add-ons can be (via just a few TB cables) shunted to an equipment closet or another room.
And I think I’ve read there are even longer cables available now. 20-30 meter or so I remember.
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[James Culbertson] “And to take it farther how did all you cable challenged pros deal with all the plethora of audio and video cables we used to have going every which way. I still have a lot of that snaking around.”
Me too.
But Apple’s claim is to have made a “a pro desktop computer that can actually sit on your desk.” They are the one’s showing a single untethered cute little machine that’s so small you just want to hug it. This whole thread is simply a reaction to Apple’s marketing.
The r2MPro in the hands of most pro’s will NOT be seated on a desktop because it would look something like the picture that started this thread. The argument that the older MPro would also look ridiculous is irrelevant because nobody was claiming it should be on a desktop.
The fact that I have a ton of cables already is not a convincing argument that it shouldn’t bother me to double the amount. It’s not a deal breaker, price will be that, but my own preference would be for something like the ProMax One, that is actually designed for my workflow, as opposed to the r2 which is designed to sit on the imaginary desk of an imaginary editor who’s connected to nothing other than his own assh*le.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
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nothin’ attached to nothin’
“Deciding the spine is the process of editing” F. Bieberkopf
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