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Spatial awareness and memory recall
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[tony west] “This discussion seems like it’s kind of about will the computer do the work for the search or will you.
“I don’t think it is at all. This discussion is about “I have many different choices to make on a whole variety of levels; what’s the best way for me to consider those choices.”
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[Chris Harlan] “This discussion is about “I have many different choices to make on a whole variety of levels; what’s the best way for me to consider those choices.””
I hear you Chris, but in order to make your choice, you are comparing shots to other shots (or sources to other sources) right? How are you looking for the shots that you want to compare to begin with?
If that part is sped up, doesn’t it make the choosing part more productive?
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[tony west] “I hear you Chris, but in order to make your choice, you are comparing shots to other shots (or sources to other sources) right? How are you looking for the shots that you want to compare to begin with?
If that part is sped up, doesn’t it make the choosing part more productive?
“Maybe. Maybe not. It depends on what you are working on. If you are working on something scripted, and you are pulling up a couple of shots or a couple of dozen shots, then probably yes. If you are working on a Sizzle reel with TBs of source material, then probably no.
BUT that’s really not the overall point of the discussion. I think X’s search capabilities are truly fab. I just want to have several different windows open and place them where I want to. I want color-coding and multiple, sizable icon views. I want to be able to compare two different timelines side by side, or one above the other. I want my editing space to resemble a workbench. It’s great–necessary–to have a box of index cards on my work bench, but I also want to be able to set them down where I want them to be, and not where I’m told they have to be. I want to spread them out, move them around, re-stack them, and hide them.
And, you don’t have to like any of that. That’s perfectly fine. There is a great deal of value in X’s streamlined approach. Some people work better that way, other’s don’t. That’s the point of this discussion.
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[Chris Harlan] “I just want to have several different windows open and place them where I want to. I want color-coding and multiple, sizable icon views.”
Yeah, that would all be cool. I knew when I saw the locked in UI that was going to funky for many people.
The more control you have over your work space the better.
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[tony west] “[Chris Harlan] “I just want to have several different windows open and place them where I want to. I want color-coding and multiple, sizable icon views.”
Yeah, that would all be cool. I knew when I saw the locked in UI that was going to funky for many people.
The more control you have over your work space the better.
“Agreed. And, I totally get why its right on the money for others, as well.
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[Chris Harlan] “I just want to have several different windows open and place them where I want to. I want color-coding and multiple, sizable icon views. I want to be able to compare two different timelines side by side, or one above the other. I want my editing space to resemble a workbench. It’s great–necessary–to have a box of index cards on my work bench, but I also want to be able to set them down where I want them to be, and not where I’m told they have to be. I want to spread them out, move them around, re-stack them, and hide them.”
That’s pretty much an exact description of the Lightworks UI, right down to the index cards.
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[tony west] “To me it’s all about getting the clip that I’m looking for up as fast as possible. …If you have already seen all the footage and have an idea what you are looking for.”
Tony,
I think you’re working on an assumption – that the problem being addressed is that the “shot” or shot need has been defined, and then the necessary action is to find the clip that fills that need. If that is the case, then fast search based on clips categorized and tagged in anticipation of that need is going to be the most efficient solution.
The discussion here is more about how other models work. If you haven’t even decided what the need is, what is your search going to be? Or, in other words, how do you set up your editing workspace to best suit your approach to figuring out what your doing?
(Chris Harlan said it better.)
[Chris Harlan] “This discussion is about “I have many different choices to make on a whole variety of levels; what’s the best way for me to consider those choices.”
[tony west] “It’s like Apple is saying, let the computer do the work. … This discussion seems like it’s kind of about will the computer do the work for the search or will you.”
There was some interesting discussion here at release about how Apple was designing around “editing intent” and I think this follows on that idea – if you’re doing browser-based editing (and Bill Davis has talked about this extensively) then you’ll likely find FCPX an excellent fit with your approach.
Franz.
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[Bill Davis] “Aindreas, Chris H, Herb, Franz, and even David H have long histories here. I respect all of their opinions, (yes, even Aindreas’s!) but I can’t help but cast their arguments in the same skewed light that the clearly cast mine. And now they form the nucleas of the group arguing that X is “suspect” by virtue of some untestable and ill defined spacial awareness failing?”
Bill,
There is no “us” vs. “them” here – you seem to be very attached to the idea that it’s a fight for the king of editing machines.
If you want to make a division, you could divide commentators into those who have and NLE that they are settled on, and those that are surveying a very changed landscape in post (and entertaining the idea that they may never again have an NLE of choice).
Franz.
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[Franz Bieberkopf] “The discussion here is more about how other models work. If you haven’t even decided what the need is, what is your search going to be?”
Yes, you are right. I think it tripped me up because so much of what I cut I shot myself, and when I’m shooting something I’m shooting it for the edit. I’m cutting it in my head as I’m shooting it.
I never want to get back to the edit without having what I need so I’m thinking about what I need while I’m shooting.
Even in the case where I’m just cutting another directors script, I’m following their instructions of what they want to go where.
In the first case I know what I have and I’m just going and getting it.
In the second, I’m being instructed to go and get it.You both are right about Why X fits my style, because it’s mostly go get, and it gets well.
“If you haven’t even decided what the need is” That’s it. In my cases somebody has already decided it.
I’m almost never coming at something from such a clean slate.
I would like to try it though.
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Bill Davies’I’m not sure if we’ll ever know whether or not what we’re labeling “spacial thinkers” is as useful a construct as some here appear to believe.’
The brain was wired to think spatially before we had language, recall and calculations done in the visual cortex allows greater depth, breadth and speed.see this
https://www.guardian.co.uk/science/alexs-adventures-in-numberland/2012/oct/29/mathematicsAindreas’ point about derren brown is well made, memory feats are invariably done like this. these people arent savants or freaks, theyre merely using the part of the brain that works best for this kind of thing,
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