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scrutinising FCPX and john davidson’s timelapse.
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[Shawn Miller] “I don’t know Aindreas, it seems like that kind of functionality could be very useful in an NLE. I would love to be able to change the font color or scale of 50 or 60 lower thirds titles with a few simple lines of text.”
Shawn, I’m suggesting there could be a lot more to it than that, too.
Think about how proceduralism works in a tool like Houdini or XSI. You can make structural alterations to a scene based on data that you import into the scene.
For an NLE, this might be something like establishing a rule that you put up a lower third for each interviewee the first time they appear in each segment of the program. If you insert a new interview clip into the program before an existing clip with the same interviewee in the same segment, the NLE could re-flow the title for you.
This is a bit off-the-cuff, so I’m sure there are better examples, but procedural editorial could guide a good number of routine or simple decision-tree-oriented tasks.
Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events -
[Shawn Miller] ” I would love to be able to change the font color or scale of 50 or 60 lower thirds titles with a few simple lines of text.”
very, very common request for editing software.
mind you: if we are actually talking about this, motion rigging parameters does answer that.
[Shawn Miller] “I’m a heavy user of Cinema 4D and AE, so I do find myself missing the power and flexibility of expressions when I’m editing.”
thats really interesting – maybe explain the role you see for expressions in the structure of editing in FCPX. I like and use expressions to a certain degree – I really wonder how anyone can just say that script expressions are the next thing that should happen to FCPX. What parameters are they operating on? how do we access them?
Is it within the clip specific keyframe timeline apparatus? is it in the inspector? what exactly are expression scripts supposed to provide? that implicit rigging does not?
https://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics
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[Walter Soyka] “Shawn, I’m suggesting there could be a lot more to it than that, too.
Think about how proceduralism works in a tool like Houdini or XSI. You can make structural alterations to a scene based on data that you import into the scene.”
[Walter Soyka] “This is a bit off-the-cuff, so I’m sure there are better examples, but procedural editorial could guide a good number of routine or simple decision-tree-oriented tasks.”
Absolutely, and I’m completely agreeing with you Walter. My example was a lot simpler, but I think we’re getting at the same point. Procedural workflows are extremely powerful and flexible, it’s just a shame that none of the NLEs allow you to extend their functionality in that way.
Shawn
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And lets not forget what the timeline index can do right now (and, of course, where I could see it going further).
With tracks, you could select groups of clips by a solo track selection. Right? Select everything in A1, for example, and add a filter.
With the timeline index, you can also select a group (or groups) of clips, because as we know, there’s no A1.
I could see a lot being done with the timeline index, but if you’re willing to reject it as “pie in the sky” Apple bullshit, then take it for what it is. A way to select clips by a certain set of criteria. That’s a pretty crucial function to an NLE.
It also serves as a navigation tool and cross check (“I see shot A001_C001_010111 has the wrong audio channel selected. I know it’s in this 1.75 hour timeline with 1100 edits. Let me search, oh there it is, as a matter of fact I see it’s in there 4 times. Let me select those , pic the proper audio channel and get on with my day”).
I don’t know what kind of personal archive you maintain, Aindreas, but once you start to maintain really large archives of all kinds of jobs, dates, footage, clients, etc, metadata becomes pretty crucial to keep your head, at least somewhat above water. Metadata in FCPX can serve similar purposes. All of that Role and pie in the sky metadata is now added to FCPXMLs (you can even customize the fields that are exported). This means you can text search a pile of FCPXMLs, find any files you might be looking for, perhaps a location, and any other pertinent to keep you swimming.
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[Shawn Miller] “Procedural workflows are extremely powerful and flexible, it’s just a shame that none of the NLEs allow you to extend their functionality in that way.”
Indeed!
See this recent post on the Avid forum:
Advice for the most monotonous workflow ever… [link]
The poor fellow needs procedural editorial.
Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events -
[Walter Soyka] “The poor fellow needs procedural editorial.”
It reminds me of this EOL software: https://creativemac.digitalmedianet.com/articles/viewarticle.jsp?id=35021
Jeremy
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[Walter Soyka] “See this recent post on the Avid forum:
Advice for the most monotonous workflow ever… [link]
The poor fellow needs procedural editorial.”
Wow, talk about a great use case! 🙂
Shawn
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[Jeremy Garchow] “[Walter Soyka] “The poor fellow needs procedural editorial.”
It reminds me of this EOL software: https://creativemac.digitalmedianet.com/articles/viewarticle.jsp?id=35021
Jeremy”
Holy crap, that is just fantastic! I need that for PPro today. 🙂
Shawn
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[Shawn Miller] “Holy crap, that is just fantastic! I need that for PPro today. :-)”
No kidding.
I think it was kind of ahead of its time, unfortunately. It was a fantastic idea, seemed to be well implemented and supported, but it was right before the truly file based onslaught of digital media and IP video networks and structures.
Jeremy
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[Aindreas Gallagher] “[Shawn Miller] “I’m a heavy user of Cinema 4D and AE, so I do find myself missing the power and flexibility of expressions when I’m editing.”
thats really interesting – maybe explain the role you see for expressions in the structure of editing in FCPX. I like and use expressions to a certain degree – I really wonder how anyone can just say that script expressions are the next thing that should happen to FCPX. What parameters are they operating on? how do we access them?”
Unfortunately, I can’t speak to FCPX specifically as I’ve never used it. But I do see great potential in being able to automate tedious tasks that normally have to be done by hand… or even the ability to link the attributes of one object or effect to control the behavior of another. I’m a huge fan of procedural animations and simulations for that reason.
[Aindreas Gallagher] “Is it within the clip specific keyframe timeline apparatus? is it in the inspector? what exactly are expression scripts supposed to provide? that implicit rigging does not?”
I’m not familiar with rigging or FCPX, so it’s hard to answer this question. But what I would like to see in an NLE is a dedicated expressions panel, one that exposes all of the attributes of the metadata, objects (media), effects and functions of the software. That way, I can create tools and workflows once and then use or tweak them as needed. As an example, I would love to be able to tag a bunch of clips (say, the first shot in a bunch of interviews) and add an intro, a transition and a title card to them all with a few nodes or lines of text. Or as Walter suggests, you could write an expression that dynamically builds title cards based on XML or XMP name, dimension and start time attributes.
I guess what I’m really thinking about is an AE, C4D mashup where you can build node based scripts that work at the clip, sequence or application level. How great would it be to have an expression that builds and populates bins based on the metadata of your media; all media for scene 01201b goes here, all similar media types get their own sub bins based on geo location, date, camera type, shooter, producer or whatever you desire. Anyway, I think there is a world of useful things you could do in an NLE or an encoder with expressions… but again, I recognize that it’s not for everyone.
Shawn
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