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Quantifiable evidence
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[Scott Witthaus] “I would hardly say that is representative.”
It’s not, which is why I object to surveys.
But the best ANY survey can do is be specific. This is of course less than a survey. It’s a poll, which require even MORE specificity to be useful. “Hey, what do you guys want on your pizza?” is a legit poll question. Extrapolate even one step from there about what MOST people want on pizza, and you’re just making it up. Useless.
So to ask “this group of colorists” is entirely legit, and as you point, extrapolating out even one step further is useless.
The last ACE survey I can find is, ironically, 2010, the year before It Happened. My theory based strictly on anecdotes from a number of directions is that Avid use went UP, as a number of Avid to FCP folks went back to Avid. Not a matter of laziness or fear, but of productivity. Gotta get to work, man. We’ll think about the rest when we get a break….which in those cycles, is pretty rare.
Which is why it’s also useless to extrapolate even one step further from THEM.
The most we can hope for in any of these discussions is specificity. If done properly, none of these polls will relate to anyone except those answering.
Now then, a properly done SURVEY will be able to account for the opinions of people who don’t answer, but there are no proper surveys being done like this. To the extent they ever will be, they won’t be conducted on the web.
But as a specific answer from a specific group with specific needs, well, you have the answer. And outside those people, you’re exactly right, Scott. Means nothing.
Specifics, though, those are the only things worth anything. The more specific, the more minute, the less broadly applicable: the better.
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[Tim Wilson] “I don’t think either of these can be overstated.”
there’s not a few trying to figure out the exact point a draft composite ppro selection gets sent to AE for pre-comp that works best going forward for final edit.
you’d also say if someone large is really all in right now, ppro at facility level is currently a rollercoaster to put it mildly.
https://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics
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Am I the only one that reads this poll numbers as “damn Apple NLEs are dominating the market by a huge margin. They acct for 68% while Avid or Adobe can’t even break past 55%” 🙂
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[Bret Williams] “Am I the only one that reads this poll numbers as “damn Apple NLEs are dominating the market by a huge margin. They acct for 68% while Avid or Adobe can’t even break past 55%” 🙂
“It’s called FCP Legend for a reason. 😉
It was EOL’d over 3 years ago (the last major update was over 7 years ago!) and it’s still a very widely used NLE (51% in this poll).
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Much as I hate polls of one and being a colorist and sound post person, the numbers match my experience except Pr is lower as is FCPX. FCP Legend is still the boss in docos for me and Avid is second.
So I would put it as FCP7 70%, Avid 15%, Pr 10%, X 3% and Resolve 2%. Resolve snuck in because I used it to edit two small jobs but I usually don’t edit. The Avid percentage is about to rise on the next few months work booked in. Legend just sticks and the small numbers who have left have gone to Pr & Avid.
Again that is in my tiny part of the world of broadcast & cinema docos + short films at the bottom of the planet.
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[Tim Wilson] ”
With such a low barrier to try it out — $80? Why not? — and an adoption that doesn’t require rewiring one’s mind or workflow, AND integration with After Effects, I think a lot of people are kicking themselves wondering why they didn’t do this sooner. I also think more and more people are going to find it harder and harder to resist, even among those who’ve been hold-outs for strongly-held business philosophy objections. If it’s a good fit for your work, chances are good that it’s also the BEST fit, which historically may not have been the same thing. :-)”Resistance is not futile! 😉 LOL
While in agreement with what you are saying here, I still feel subscription only a bit risky for a simple reason. Perhaps being a bit irrational but what if certain products or services are dropped, the price goes up or both? That and no off ramp is my main concern. I bloody well might give up one day and subscribe. I know at the end of the day, this is just a business model Adobe chose to adopt.
Side note here, debate as you so desire, just watching to see what BMD has planned for Fusion and Resolve going forward. This could be the solution some are looking for. Solid tools that you own, not rent. My two cents, whatever it is worth. At least price of gas is going down.
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[Tim Wilson] ” It Happened.”
That is hilarious.As a side note, for some reason I am in the process of finishing another degree and a chunk of it has to do with research, statistics and the ability to generalize. It would be a helluva challenge to get a true, random population of NLE users, or even “professional” NLE users. I think another interesting question would be “what NLE would you like to use” in your work rather than “use” or “have to use” because that’s what my employer put in front of me. I got a feeling PPro would do rather well there, as there seem to be a lot of “Adobe Curiosity” out there!
Scott Witthaus
Senior Editor/Post Production Supervisor
1708 Inc./Editorial
Professor, VCU Brandcenter -
I am interested in these results because they suggest the Highlander Theory of NLEs (“There can be only one!”) is not correct.
I’m also interested in these results because they come from a different group of people, and as such, they run counter to some conventional wisdom here (“Avid is dead” and “Who uses Premiere?” and “FCPX is for quick-turnaround work, not collaboration”).
Note that none of the words in quotation marks are actually direct quotations from anyone.
[Scott Witthaus] “It would be a helluva challenge to get a true, random population of NLE users, or even “professional” NLE users.”
Even if you had one, to whom would polling or survey results be useful? What questions could they really answer? Is a random population of NLE users really any more meaningful to you or to me than any of these non-random polls?
That said… while I don’t think someone should rely on popularity contests to decide what software to use, I have myself used them to decide what not to use. The fact that I could only locate a handful of people who were actively using Avid DS is one of two reasons I declined to buy one a few years ago. Although I consider DS and FCP X to be in vastly different situations, maybe that’s just a long way of coming back to Tim’s point from a couple of threads ago?
Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive | RenderBreak [blog] | Profile [LinkedIn] -
[Michael Gissing] ” I would put it as FCP7 70%”
Wow, I’m surprised at that. I have not seen anybody working on Legend in quite a while in my town.
I used to think of the midwest as behind the coast. I guess not.
A brand new studio just got built here that somebody sunk a lot of cash into. They have Prp in there.
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FCP 7 has been EOL for several years and it’s still BBC Washington’s primary edit tool (not sure about London end) with no sign of change soon. VOA is virtually an entire FCP 7 shop with hundreds of seats..and just a handful of finishing AVID’s… they’ve spend the last several years testing various systems (think they may be leading toward PP CC because the ease of use and virtually no learning curve for current FCP 7 editors)
All of this is to say that big institutions – once they have something that works – are glacially slow to change.
And a comment earlier about PP CC not playing well in networked operations….I know this has been an issue with some networked ops…specifically Dallet….and it’s not really and Adobe problem…..more the network server provider not providing the right hooks for the interface.
Andy Field
FieldVision Productions
N. Bethesda, Maryland 20852
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