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More “demystification”…
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[Bill Davis] “The same controls are NOT disfunctional in one mode with one set of files, but they are disfunctional in a different mode with other files?
That’s kinda weird isn’t it? “
I would encourage you to actually participate in the “science” and follow along with Simon’s video.
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Well, I tried to.
Then, like most of ACTUAL engineering – the more I read, the more complex and befuddling the topic appeared to become.
Simon presented it as simply “they should have simply divided THIS by THAT underneath this control – and they messed things up because they didn’t do that.”
Then others expanded my thinking into color spaces, how the math actually changes depending on whether the software is in REC 709 or REC 2020 – and now, it seems to me that the solution might be a BOATLOAD more complex than I first imagined.
The good news, is that there are ACUTAL electrical engineers and software designers, who are surely looking at this now – and I’m sure THEY will figure it out.
On a personal, note, you’ve also got to understand something…
It REALLY felt like another “here we go again” on this subject to me: Magnetic Timeline: READY-FIRE-AIM— Trackless Audio: READY-FIRE-AIM —NOW it’s “Apple has screwed up color correction in 10.4 – READY-FIRE-AIM…
The internet is AWASH today with READY-FIRE-AIM. And those folks were out in force in the first two days of this discussion by accepting the simple narrative: “How could Apple allow such a fundamental functional SCREWUP in the new tool.”
Now, thanks to Simon, Oliver and many others, those first few days of “HEY, THIS IS REALLY BROKEN” voices have quieted a bit- as the discussion has revealed how it MIGHT be more complex than it appeared at first blush – and now perhaps, time and reasoned discussion and solutions can take over.
Don’t get me wrong, I KNOW it still may be BROKEN – FULL STOP.
And, yes, my personal triggering is definitely a factor . After all, THIS is the place I argued for years that Apple had a reason that they did THOSE things people were Ready-Fire-Aiming about originally. I’d even argue that the view largely accepted now that the dust has cleared is that they had perfectly legitimate reasons for doing all of those things.
But that READY-FIRE-AIM environment is STILL largely our new reality.
And that means it’s more critical than ever to go beyond just the “shouting fire” stage.
Which is where I kinda thought this things was headed in the first days of this thread.
Just my 2 cents.
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
I just sent in a bug report on the rec 709 color wheel flaw. Too bad. I really do like the functionality and GUI of the wheels but you end up chasing your tail when you start using them. So: back to the color board/Color Finale/Chromatic for now.
Hope they fix this fast.
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[Bill Davis] “It REALLY felt like another “here we go again” on this subject to me: Magnetic Timeline: READY-FIRE-AIM— Trackless Audio: READY-FIRE-AIM —NOW it’s “Apple has screwed up color correction in 10.4 – READY-FIRE-AIM…”
And because that is your default response, so many of us get frustrated with you because most of us are not in attack dog mode. I was beginning to wonder if you were reading what we were posting, hence my comment that you were clutching at straws. Your typical defence, which seems triggered by your default response, is frustrating and irritating when it seems you are not listening to reasoned argument and proofs. This also extends to opinion which, when it differs but is perfectly valid, also seems to trigger your default response.
We don’t all hate FCPX. And even if we don’t or can’t use it, our reasons are no less valid. Specifically they are not an attack on X which we have all seen develop into a tool that many use with precision and pleasure.
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[Bill Davis] “Simon presented it as simply “they should have simply divided THIS by THAT underneath this control – and they messed things up because they didn’t do that.””
I wasn’t going to contribute further to this discussion because I think I’ve more than outstayed my welcome, but I have to put down a marker here.
I did not at any point in any terms whatsoever suggest or imply, let alone state or “present”, that Apple have “messed up”, as you are explicitly saying here that I did.
On the contrary, I have throughout strenuously and repeatedly (almost to the point of tiresomeness) resisted any such suggestion whenever anyone (including you!) attempted to make it.
There is simply no doubt about this. It is a matter of unequivocal record.
May I ask you to retract this claim, please?
Yours amicably, S.
Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki -
Fair enough, Simon.
Consider any implied criticism fully and publicly retracted.
I freely acknowledge that you came back into the discussion subsequent to your initial post, and made it SUPER clear that you were NOT saying X was flawed.
Just please understand this IS still EXACTLY how those initial “FCP X is NOT a professional tool” memes got started in 2011. Instead of saying from square one “I don’t get what APPLE is trying to do here.” The messaging that started to catch fire was that X was once again flawed for professional use. (Thank god at least THIS TIME Conan didn’t hear about it!)
What breaks loose in public today is often a crapshoot in the world of PR.
AGAIN, you were very clear in your subsequent messaging.
And, I really do appreciate that.
Peace.
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
[Bill Davis] “What breaks loose in public today is often a crapshoot in the world of PR.”
As of January 11, 2018 Apple’s market valuation is $891.66 billion. I don’t think a random anomaly in one of their products will cause undo harm.
I Hate Television. I Hate It As Much As Peanuts. But I Can’t Stop Eating Peanuts.
– Orson Welles -
[Bill Davis] “I freely acknowledge that you came back into the discussion subsequent to your initial post, and made it SUPER clear that you were NOT saying X was flawed. “
Thanks.
[Bill Davis] “Instead of saying from square one “I don’t get what APPLE is trying to do here.” The messaging that started to catch fire was that X was once again flawed for professional use. “
One final clarification:
I explicitly and clearly labelled my initial video as a “Mystery” – specifically, “Apple FCP X 10.4: The Color Wheels Mystery”.
And I concluded it by saying (almost verbatim): “I don’t get what Apple is trying to do here.” Specifically I said: “I just don’t understand it”.
I still don’t know what Apple are trying to do and I don’t pretend to.
Who steals my purse steals trash; ’tis something, nothing;
‘Twas mine, ’tis his, and has been slave to thousands;
But he that filches from me my good name
Robs me of that which not enriches him,
And makes me poor indeed.Simon Ubsdell
tokyo productions
hawaiki -
[Simon Ubsdell] “[Bill Davis] “Instead of saying from square one “I don’t get what APPLE is trying to do here.” The messaging that started to catch fire was that X was once again flawed for professional use. ”
One final clarification:
I explicitly and clearly labelled my initial video as a “Mystery” – specifically, “Apple FCP X 10.4: The Color Wheels Mystery”.”
So many windmills!
\”Traditional NLEs have timelines. FCPX has storylines\” W.Soyka
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[Simon Ubsdell] “I still don’t know what Apple are trying to do and I don’t pretend to.
“I think most people on the forum appreciate the work you and Oliver have done on this, including myself.
I kind of looked at your thread in two parts, 1) your explanation of how conventional colors wheels work as oppose to the way apple’s did, and 2) you insisted that apple had done it this way on purpose.
“Again I want to stress that Apple have not “done anything wrong” here and it’s not a bug. It’s a choice they have legitimately made.”
I was curious about that second part from the beginning and I’m still a little curious about it. How did you know that was “a choice they have legitimately made.”? Did apple tell you that?
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