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Mixing XDCam 23.98 & SD For 29.97 output
Hi,
I’ve read many posts relating to this subject but I haven’t really found one definitive answer to my question. Here’s what I’m trying to do:
I’ve got a project that was shot with an EX-3 at 23.98. I will be adding to this material for final output, both 1080i graphic material (in the form of ProRes 422 files) and short clips of SD archival material (which I will transcode to ProRes 422 using Compressor). The final project will be output to HDCam via HDSDI using a Kona LHi card and needs to be delivered at 29.97. I’m trying to figure out what the best work flow is for this project.
I’ve figured out that I’ll need to edit in a 29.97 ProRes timeline. This is because if I edit in a native XDCam 23.98 timeline, my other footage will be converted twice (once to 23.98 on the way in and again to 29.97 on the way out). Needless to say this is not a good plan and will subject it to the weird 4:1 pulldown described below.
I guess the biggest issue is the conversion of the 23.98 material to 29.97 with a correct 3:2 pulldown. I’ve tried using FCP and Compressor to do the conversion but I end up with a 4:1 pulldown (4 moving frames followed by 1 still frame).
I’ve looked in Compressor for some setting that mentions the 3:2 pulldown and cannot find it. I’ve also looked in MPEG streamclip and cannot find it there either. I checked Nattress as well and it’s unclear if their tools do this. Their website mentions only NTSC, I couldn’t find anything specific to HD.
Does anyone have a definitive way to accomplish the transcode from XDCam 23.98 to ProRes 29.97 with a real 3:2 pulldown? It seems like it’s prudent to do this conversion before import into FCP so there’s no worrying for the editors about rendering. I’m also worried about the time it will take to do this conversion. I’ll be using a a Quad core Mac and will make all 8 cores available to Compressor so I’m hoping that the ratio of conversion won’t be too bad.
I hope I’ve been clear enough.
Thanks,
Philip
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5 Replies
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Hi Philip,
Compressor can indeed do proper 3:2 pulldown insertion. Search the forum and you should find several posts that discuss the correct settings to use.
But given the you have mostly 23.98 footage and just a little 29.97 material, it seems inefficient to me to convert all your footage to 29.97. If it were me, I’d probably edit natively in 23.98 (with a placeholder for the 29.97 material), lock the picture, convert the final program to 29.97, then add the 29.97 SD material.
Hope this helps,Matt Lyon
Editor
Toronto -
Hi Matt,
Indeed, I’ve found several posts detailing the process to get 3:2 out of Compressor. I was just nervous as the settings don’t actually say 3:2 anywhere. I guess I’ll just have to test it and see.
I wish I could just put placeholders for the SD footage but there’s too much of it and it wouldn’t work anyway as I’ve got other 29.97 ProRes footage that is integral to the show.
It’s crazy but my only option seems to be to convert all this 23.98 footage to ProRes in Compressor. It’s about 600GB. I can’t imagine how long this is going to take! I’ll talk to the editor about rendering on the fly and see how that pans out.
It’s a drag that FCP doesn’t handle mixed formats well.
Thanks,
Philip
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Yeah, the settings for adding 3:2 pulldown in compressor are not intuitive at all 🙂 Like you said, I’d test a file and make sure it works, then run the batch.
I didn’t realize you had so much 29.97 footage. You might still want to consider editing in a mixed timeline with the 4:1 pulldown, and then doing a conform at the end … converting just the actual 23.98 footage you used, instead of ALL the rushes. That can be a PITA though too! Good planning is essential; like keeping all the 23.98 footage on its own track(s).
I’ve also read about people having success with editing in a 59.94 timeline. I haven’t tested it myself though, so I can’t comment.
Matt Lyon
Editor
Toronto -
Hi Matt,
How would you go about keeping the tracks separate and then doing the conform at the end? I like that idea. It lets the editor do what she wants, lets the clients see the output and gets a good result at the end. Can you specify a specific video track to send to compressor? After you do that, how do you re-link the media to the timeline?
Thanks,
Philip
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Hi Philip,
This approach does require a fair bit of user involvement. I guess you need to decide if it will be more efficient for your project (and set aside time on the backend to do the conform). As with anything, I would do a little test with a short sequence and see if you like the approach and verify that it works.
Here’s what I would do:
1. Lock the show
2. Duplicate your timeline and delete all clips and tracks you don’t need to convert
3. Select all clips and remove all filters, speed and motion effects.
3. Use media manager to export copies of your clips to be converted. Using the right settings here is essential:COPY media referenced by duplicated items. ENABLE “delete unused media” (you may want to add handles if you anticipate needing to massage your edits after the conform is done).
DISABLE “include master clips” and “include affiliate clips.”
ENABLE “duplicate selected items and place in new project.”
If all goes well, you will end up with a new project with a copy of your timeline and a folder on your HD with a bunch of clips in it. Now you can import these clips into Compressor and batch process.
For relinking, you should now open your locked timeline and add a new video track. Duplicate the clips that you had targeted for conversion. Right click and make them “independent clips” then make them offline (leave the files on disk, when prompted). Now relink to your new clips. Because you duplicated the clips and left an old copy of the non-converted versions, you can now compare the two and make sure the timing matches.
You’ll also need to make sure all your effects and filters are preserved (they should be!).
Hope this helps!
Matt Lyon
Editor
Toronto
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