Media Manager was NOT fixed in 5.02

[Tunaking]

If you leave “Include Master Clips”, MM will not delete the unused media. I’ve done a set of MM tests to see what works and what doesn’t. Also watch out for clips that are running backwards.

[Bill Russell]

Not true. Not in my current experience. 🙁 Read here:

https://forums.creativecow.net/cgi-bin/new_read_post.cgi?forumid=8&postid=857727

and

https://forums.creativecow.net/cgi-bin/new_read_post.cgi?forumid=8&postid=857721

“THE LOST SKELETON OF CADAVRA” –

And more…

[Tom Wolsky]

I take it all back. I was wrong about my first comments. I’m sure I saw that in an earlier version, but I’m not getting that in 5.0.2.

[Sean Oneil]

[TK] “If you leave “Include Master Clips”, MM will not delete the unused media. I’ve done a set of MM tests to see what works and what doesn’t. Also watch out for clips that are running backwards. “

Gee, ya think. No kidding. Read the first post. I mean actually read it. The part where I said “uncheck Include Master Clips” doesn’t work. This and other unhelpful posts do nothing but confuse the situation and are probably a reason why Apple hasn’t fixed it. There’s even someone telling me to “calm down” because he knows it works in 4.5 so it must work in 5.02. Unbelievable. No, I will not calm down, and I can’t help but laugh at the arrogant replies I’ve seen from people who haven’t even tried it. Yes, I used MM in 4.5 w/o this problem and I know how it works. And I actually like MM.

CharlieX and others have discovered the same thing. There are only two groups of people here. Those who’ve tried it and discovered the problem in FCP 5, and those who haven’t tried it yet. Again, once the media is already trashed and the media is offline, then it is IMPOSSIBLE to recapture a sequence without recapturing all of the source footage (unless you actually change the source TC for the clips, totally impractical for a normal workflow).

I have something to say to the FCP 5 users who have actually tried this and not experienced the problem. Say hello to Bigfoot and the Tooth Fairy for me. Because like them, you don’t exist.

Just wait until FCP 5 has been around for a few more months and you have to rebuild an old sequence that’s been offline for a while. You’ll figure it out soon enough.

Sorry for acting like a jerk, but I’m really ticked off. If these kinds of responses didn’t happen the first time this issue was discussed, and people actually tried it and discovered it themseleves instead of screaming “NEWBIE!” then perhaps it would have been fixed in the 5.02 update. I know everyone’s just trying to help, but it doesn’t help to blurt out things without following what’s going on.

[Sean Oneil]

B Russ, thanks for trying to help (my company put together the EPK for your movie BTW).

There are no speed changes in what I was trying to recapture. I think you’ve missed the key ingredient here. It’s when the media is already gone, deleted, trashed, offline. That is when this problem occurs, the problem where MM’s “make offline” and “delete unused media” whilst making sure not to “include master clips outside of selection” does not work.

[Tom Wolsky]

The problem is a function of how your material was captured and how it was edited. All material doesn’t behave the same way. If you log and capture and only use some of the shots, those are the shots that will show up for capturing. If you capture big chunks and cut them into subclips, and then edit from the subclips, again, only those pieces of media that are in the used subclips will show up needing capturing. If you’re captured big chunks, and simply cut shots from the big chunks, it’s going to do what happens to you, wanting to capture everything from the big chunks of video. Yes, I’ve tried it.

[Tom Wolsky]

I misphrased that, only the subclips from which pieces of media were taken, will need to be recaptured. But the whole subclip will have to be recaptured, but only the subclips that were used.

[Sean Oneil]

I don’t think you did try it. I’m not calling you a liar, I just think you missed the key element which is to throw away all the media first. I know I wouldn’t trash all my media just to test this out. This is not a typical “uprez” online. This is once the media is already gone. Step by step, did you do this?

1. Digitize an hour tape (or whatever)
2. Mark an in and out in the viewer to make a 30 sec clip.
3. Drag it into a sequence
4. Save and Quit. DELETE THE MEDIA FILE(S) from this project in your capture scratch folder. Empty the trash.
5. Start the project up and ignore the missing media.
6. Ctrl-click the seqence and select Media Manager.
7. Choose “Create Offline”.
8. Check “Delete Unused Media”
9. Uncheck “Include Master Clips Outside selection”
10. Select a place to save a new project.
11. Hit ok. Close the old project and work in the new one.
12. Ctrl-click the sequence and hit “batch capture”

Is the capture time 30 seconds or 1 hour? If you followed these steps and it’s 30 seconds, it will be the first I have heard this confirmed. Again, nobody has yet said “Yes, I trashed all my media first and it still works in Final Cut 5”. Trust me it doesn’t work. And if it does work for you (which I really don’t think it will), then it doesn’t work for some people which is still a huge problem. Now on to the troubleshooting.

1. Select the sequence and choose “Make sequence clips independent” – doesn’t work.
2. Select all the clips in the sequence and choose “create subclips” – it won’t create them because the media is missing
3. Drag the clips into a new project. Select them and make them independent. – still doesn’t work.

If all your clips were already subclips, then perhaps it will work. In fact it probably will. But that’s not part of my workflow nor is it supposed to be required for batch capturing portions of source footage once the media is offline.

[Sean Oneil]

[Tom Wolsky] “I misphrased that, only the subclips from which pieces of media were taken, will need to be recaptured. But the whole subclip will have to be recaptured, but only the subclips that were used.”

So are you saying that the portions of those subclips which are not in your sequence are still being recaptured? Well that’s a huge problem and it’s exactly what we’re talking about. It is not supposed to work that way. People can argue that if they like, but other non-linear editors like…. I dunno, FInal Cut 4, Final Cut 5 is the only one I’ve seen with this limitation. The whole purpose of the “delete unused media” option is so that you are only digitizing footage that is in your seuqence (plus handles that you specify).

[Bill Russell]

I think you’ve missed the key ingredient here. It’s when the media is already gone, deleted, trashed, offline. That is when this problem occurs, the problem where MM’s “make offline” and “delete unused media” whilst making sure not to “include master clips outside of selection” does not work.

Well, actually, that’s not true. Before you first posted about the problem, I posted about the same problem earlier in the day. I did not delete any media — I was trying to shrink a 16GB project down to size to fit on a DVD-R. FCP4.5 did it in May but with a TON of errors — mangled speed changes, motion — couldn’t do reverses to save its life; plus some normal clips got botched too, who knows why. FCP5 however did it this week nearly error-free, but barely shrunk it at all (down to 14.5GB from 16GB) even though I had everything checked as you describe above. So it is a problem with MM in general. A thread based on my experience ensued, and here is that prior discussion.

https://forums.creativecow.net/cgi-bin/new_read_post.cgi?forumid=8&postid=857511

Also of note — I have left a show MM’ing tonight in FCP5, a feature documentary. It should be about 15-20 GB (a little over an hour) but it is projected to be about 35GB. Bigger than it should be, but not enormously out of bounds — are speed changes are a contributer to the problem as Tom has stated regarding Apple’s kludge? Well I only have a few speed changes this time, maybe indicative, I dunno.

Anyway, again, on this documentary I’m copying a huge project from several drives down to one drive for transport to online, not deleting any media. There is no offline media. I was impressed at how fast the FCP5 MM was going — projected 20 Min. I’ll know tomorrow if it is at all error free.

Cheers!

“THE LOST SKELETON OF CADAVRA” –

And more…