How to fill SD dvd with as much information from HD project

[Adam Taylor]

err…why?

Adam Taylor
Video Editor/Audio Mixer/ Compositor/Motion GFX/Barista
Character Options Ltd
Oldham, UK

http://www.sculptedbliss.co.uk
My YouTube Animations Page

[Ryan Holmes]

[Grant Strac] “The max final output for sd dvd is 1.64 gb.”

I’m not really sure what this statement means. That’s as big as you can get the final output? If it’s sufficient quality what difference does it make? Bigger doesn’t mean better.

Not to be pedantic here, but you’re just dealing with a basic equation. You’re variables are data rate (audio and video) and duration (length of video). That will determine the size of your m2v. You can figure this out by doing the math for your overall data rate and the length of your video. The software won’t do it for you.

The max data rate a SD-DVD can handle is 9Mbps. Some older DVD players will choke on that data rate. So I’d call that more a theoretical max than a practical max. I’d venture a more conservative 7-8Mbps if you want your DVD to play on most (all?) DVD players.

Ryan Holmes
http://www.ryanholmes.me
vimeo.com/ryanholmes

[Chris Tompkins]

When you compress for DVD – making mpeg2 compliant files – you set the data rate.
Start around 6mb/s and see how large file you have. Keep dialing it in until you’re around 4GB for the vid track.

This way you are Maximizing the quality to space ratio.

Chris Tompkins
Video Atlanta LLC

[Grant Strac]

Chris,
I’m not sure where you’re getting the bit rate’s from unless your strictly talking about the dvd mpeg 2 settings. As I put in my post this is a personal quest. I am one of 16 people having masters certification so I am well aware of the technical theory of discs and the mpeg2 stream. I understand how a file being 287gb goes down to maximum 1.64gb, it’s the algorithm I get it. I want to see what it will look like if I fill a disc. I said above I don’t care if it even gives more quality or not. That is reason number one. I film DSLR and my files are huge and I would like to put as much as that information on disc as possible. The free space is there so I want to take advantage.
My other reason I have a four disc set coming up and I know already probably all my final outputs can fit on one disc but is being sold across 4. I would like to figure out how to write the whole disc so someone doesn’t turn it over and see less than 1/4 of each disc filled. Now I am using professional discs and duplicator so it will be hard since they are proper dvd’s but I am just thinking of all thinking ahead. I am perfectionist and if I can cover an angle I will.

Again I realize that the algorithm is not capable of much more because it’s taking such a large file down to small. With all the training I have in compressor and dvd as far as I know it’s not possible. MPEG2 is what it is.

What makes me think that maybeeee theres a way and I might just be unaware of a particular way of looking at this.

I edited this project in HD, final file size 287gb. I also converted all the footage to SD and replaced into a SD based project. The final export size was 14gb. When I take HD to dvd the disc size is 1.67 and the SD project to disc is 3.78gb.

See I have figured out this best way to deliver to disc with best quality but I just want to see if my theory is possible beyond the knowledge at hand.

Don’t bother asking me why or anything. On topic responses only. Yes or no with a explanation if necessary please. Chris thank you

As an apple certified trainer it really bothers me that people come like Ryan come with no additional advice you are wasting your time and mine. If an inexperienced person needs immediate help or myself it is counter productive to not stay with topic and answer the question like Chris. Apple teaches that we should always answer a student’s question. ask things like “well I understand what your asking but it’s really not possible because of this…” Be an adult or don’t answer posts. I get the honor of dealing with the havoc people like you spread into the world by misinforming people or wasting their time causing them to become discouraged and or scared to post on forum like this because might be ridiculed.

[Ryan Holmes]

Grant – I meant you no disrespect. Sorry if it came out that way.

What I’m saying is that you’re dealing with a math equation here. To fill up your DVD with a 30 minute show means that you would need to run a data rate of about 18Mbps. That’s double the allowable standard of a SD-DVD. Just use any bandwidth to filesize calculator to figure out your data rate vs. file size: https://web.forret.com/tools/filesize.asp?speed=7&unit=Mbps&dur=1800

As I’ve understood your post that’s what I see you asking. How do I fill up my 4.6GB DVD with a 30 minute video file. Answer: you don’t. You can run it at 9Mbps which will generate a roughly 2GB file, and fill up half the DVD. If your question was: is there an automatic setting that fills out the disc. Then I would say let DVD Studio Pro encode it and it can pick the best settings to maximize disc space. But it’s not going to fill up the disc as you say.

If your question is something else entirely then I apologize for misunderstanding.

Ryan Holmes
http://www.ryanholmes.me
vimeo.com/ryanholmes

[Eric Pautsch]

Ryan gave you a perfectly good explanation. DVD has limits and that is 9.8 mb/s (video) and 10.08 payload rate (video/audio combined).

You need to think of it in time, not file size. Thats why bitrates are offered in mb per SEC. He also explained why you should not go near the bitrate ceiling. 7-8mb/s max for burned media.

This is why you need to do a bit budget every time you make a disc. What the length of your program? Thats the first question….from there you would use a bitrate calculator (or some some simple math) to find your optimal bitrate based on your project. Here’s a calculator

https://www.videohelp.com/calc.htm

I find it hard to believe Apple training never mentioned bit budgeting.

[Alan Okey]

If you’re just looking to fill up the available space on the DVD so that it looks full to the naked eye, try adding some orphaned tracks to the DVDSP project. For example, just duplicate the existing video track but don’t add any links to or from the copied tracks. That way they won’t be accessible to the viewer, but they’ll take up space on the disc.

[Jeff Meyer]

Ryan gave a perfect response – Chris was actually incorrect here.

The limitation is a DVD player simply can not read and process 4GB of data in 30 minutes. If you want to burn 30 minutes worth of content onto a DVD disc that’s universally compatible the result will have less than 2GB of data on the disc. If you want higher bitrate SD you’ll have to consider a different delivery such as, tape (DigiBeta, DVCPRO), BluRay, or a file based option.

Apple can be as idealistic about helping people as they like, but this is a physical limitation of the DVD format. No amount of idealism in the world will change the answer. With DV50 you’re constrained to 50mbps. With a DVD the limit 10.06mbps or less for video, audio, and closed captioning. Feel free to read the Data Rate section if you don’t trust myself or Ryan:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD-Video

I would imagine Apple would have educated you about standards compliance. Actually, given how standards compliant FCX was at release, I take that back.

[Grant Strac]

Thanks, that I didn’t think of at all

[Grant Strac]

I don’t understand how your tying in idealism in answer and the facts. I was keeping those two things separate. As alway I said in this post I understand the codec I wanted to see if it would be possible to fit more on because when I do sd and hd of same project file sizes don’t add up. But thank you for the clarification to everyone on that its not possible I get that it wouldn’t add anything extra to the quality I only wanted to see if it could be done thank you