HDV Greenscreen Workflow help, please

[Alan Tailer]

Thanks for the detailed response, Dave…

Actually, I’m just trying to create more pro-looking videos to put online, I thought shooting in HDV would be an improvement, that having a larger-pixel capture would improve the final result even if the final video was 360×240 (or am I wrong about that?)… Or is it more about how the video’s processed AFTER shooting?

I’m not even after the “wide-screen” look, just trying to create some low-budget music videos to put online that don’t look really amateurish. I’m going to have to compare my old DV camera to the HDV I just got to see if it justifies the huge extra hassle I’m having working with the HDV output. Thanks again for your comments, I’ve got a big learning curve ahead of me.

Edit: I guess this is off-topic, but here’s a video claiming to show the difference between DV and HDV:
https://youtube.com/watch?v=_GIiU7YQAHc
…Is that legit? (HDV is automatically better even when rendered to 320×240 versus DV), or does that say more about the quality of the camera lense of that specific HDV recorder?

[Kevin Camp]

shooting hdv and down-rezing should look better than down-rezing dv. the down-rezing will help to reduce the noticeable artifacting of the dv codec, the more you down-rez the less noticeable the artifacts….

the question is, is it worth the extra hassle? i don’t know…

another way to improve quality is in the final compression. i’ve never posted to youtube, but i’m sure i’ve read some recommendations here at the cow for compressing for youtube. i remember something about if you use their native codec/compression settings you can avoid youtube recompressing your media and get better looking videos.

try searching the ae archives for ‘you tube compression’.

back to hdv… you might want to consider exporting or even capturing your hdv to photojpeg at best (or 100%) quality. ae works very well with photojpeg, and the file size will be significantly smaller than uncompressed or lossless compression. photojpeg should be an export option using quicktime from most nle’s.

Kevin Camp
Designer – KCPQ, KMYQ & KRCW

[Richard Harrington]

[HV20idiot] “even if the final video was 360×240 (or am I wrong about that?)”

You mean 320 X 240

And bigger images that use less information than the DV codec… are just bigger images that look terrible…

HDV and Keying DO NOT go well together

HDV in some cases, like Sony’s XDCAM and JVC Pro HD can work well for some scenarios… but I stay away from it in Motion graphics

[Tim Kolb]

Well…I guess I’ll be the outcast here and say that while HDV may not be the pinnacle of greenscreen acquistion, it certainly keys better than NTSC DV if only because of the 4X pixel count and the 2×2 (4:2:0) color difference subsample block vs. NTSC DV’s 4×1…(4:1:1).

While I’d never approach say, a national spot with an HDV key…I’ve certainly keyed competently shot HDV greenscreen footage and it’s no worse than dealing with HVX footage…

I would key it in an HD comp, but choose a non-square pixel 1440×1080 comp and then what I would do is render it out at full res composited and allow myself some pan and scan in the final project.

If the edges get messy, the best tip I ever got on keying DV was from Rick Gerard, a one-time AE forum host here at the Cow…it helps HDV as well, though typically the issue it resolves isn’t nearly as obvious in HDV anyway.

Take your key clip and put it into a composition. Place it in the composition twice-exactly on “top” of itself. Take the top layer and apply a small blur (gaussian, fast, whatever you like) of about 2 pixels (adjust to taste). Then set the top layer’s blend mode to “color”. The top layer will smooth out a lot of edge artifacts, and will also help with general color noise present in the more compressed formats. Use this composition (you’ll see it in your project panel) as a clip in a new composition where you key it over the background.

Good luck with it, and yes, starting with a higher res original image will help the final product look better, but follow any tips for compressing to YouTube standards that you can as avoiding recompression of non-compliant material will be the key to getting it to look like you intend.

TimK,
Director, Consultant
Kolb Productions,

Creative Cow Host,
Author/Trainer
http://www.focalpress.com
http://www.classondemand.net

[Alan Tailer]

I appreciate everyone’s responses, this board has been VERY helpful. I just purchased an HDV camera, and got so frustrated I was almost on the verge of returning it. (Frustrated trying to figure out the camera AND software AND how they work together, etc) After struggling through a lot of things, I can see it’s going to work well for me, and I thank everyone for their feedback!