DV FIELS ISSUE when convert to 10bit Uncompressed

[Rafael Amador]

Hi Franco,
I guess you have applied some speed changes.
Shift-fields doesn’t works in this case.
If this is the case, you need to delete the shift-fields filter, nest the clips with the speed changes and apply the shift-fields filter over the nested clips.
Hope it helps,
rafael

http://www.nagavideo.com

[Hector Berrebi]

hi Franco

another thing.

if your project was shot on DV (any sort of DV on any camera) than it was recorded to tape as 8 bit. there is no need really to use 10 bit uncompressed (unless there is extensive 3D or 2D animation) which is hard drive and system consuming, and ads little to no significant data

for a good online to your DV material,

recapture timeline through capture card (SDI or component) as 8 bit uncompressed or even better, as Prores HQ.

you can’t turn DV 10 bit.

🙂

Hector Berrebi
Schibber Group
prePost Consulting

[Michael Gissing]

Is the “comb like” effect on all shots or as Rafael suggests just speed changes?

How are you viewing this quicktime? Just on a computer screen or external interlaced monitor? If you make a QT from the DV timeline before it was dropped into the Uncompressed does it look the same?

On the issue of 8 bit or 10 bit, I prefer a 10 bit uncompressed timeline, because that’s where your final render will happen of all your elements including the grade of your DV footage. Recapturing in my experience makes no difference, but doing the final render in a 10 bit timeline does. It is not making DV 10 bit, but it is giving you finer grey scale increments for your grade and it helps other elements like graphics. If like me you are using a lots of filters, you will see a small but important difference.

These days hard drive space and system speed in SD is trivial unless you are keeping old machines going.

[Rafael Amador]

[Michael Gissing] “but doing the final render in a 10 bit timeline does. It is not making DV 10 bit, but it is giving you finer grey scale increments for your grade and it helps other elements like graphics. If like me you are using a lots of filters, you will see a small but important difference. “
I agree 100% with you Michael. I don’t use many graphics neither apply many effects but I can see the difference when CC. In 10b, the Nattress “Chroma Smooth/Sharpening” makes a perfect job.
Rafael

http://www.nagavideo.com

[Franco Bogino]

Hi
the 10bit conversion is indeed for the purpose of grading and other effect I am applying.

The comb effect has only appeared since converting to 10bit uncompressed. The original DV quicktimes did not display this. At the moment I am only monitoring on a computer monitor, with a view check on a CRT when I have access.
The final output does have to look good on the quicktime for two reasons:

1 there will be a final version distributed as quicktime and DVD.
2 I need to be able to send to Color for grade, so the files must be SD uncompressed with correct field order, and no artefacts.

I was considering recapturing trough SDI, but I do not have easy access to a system capable at the moment, so I was looking at alternative solutions for now.
I’m all ears for any acceptable software workarounds. I am using Studio 2 with FCP 6.0.2

Many thanks.

Franco

London based Avid/ FCP offline editor.
FCP Online.

[Michael Gissing]

Franco, although you didn’t specify that it is on all shots, I will have to assume that that is the case.

If you go to your filter tab, firstly check that the shift field filter is there and that there is only one of them and it is ticked on. Assuming that there is only one filter and it is on, then what happens if you tick it off and play the rendered shot?

In PAL the DV footage is lower (why the tech heads chose to have DV the only lower field PAL is beyond me). Uncompressed is of course upper. Check also that your original DV files are properly set to lower. If that has been changed then that may be your problem. I often have projects with your workflow, but never had any field problems except on shots with speed changes. There is a different fix for that but I will wait to see if that is actually your problem.

[Franco Bogino]

Hi Michael

My original footage is PAL Mini DV, with field dominance correctly appearing as lower (even). I have put my clips onto a 10bit uncompressed timeline, each with the field filter applied and set to -1. When I export these as a quicktime reference and view the resulting clips in quicktime player they all display the comb effect.

I am using FCP 6.0.2 and Quicktime 7.5.5

London based Avid/ FCP offline editor.
FCP Online.

[Franco Bogino]

..oh, and also I am not applying any speed effects. I have tried exports of clean shots with all effects stripped off except for the field filter. still have the same comb effect on all shots.

London based Avid/ FCP offline editor.
FCP Online.

[Rafael Amador]

[Michael Gissing] “why the tech heads chose to have DV the only lower field PAL is beyond m”
I’ve questioning my self and questioning many people about that without an answer.
The only idea that comes to my mid is that this is to avoid professional PAL vtrs to preview NTSC tapes as can be done with DV.
Rafael

http://www.nagavideo.com

[Vincent Manuhuwa]

Wait wait, I’m not really sure there is a problem here because:

Quicktime (when set to High Quality) shows the interlace lines even when the field order is correct. So seeing a comb effect is not a bad thing, as quicktime just shows you the fields.

So that said:

Does your movie stutter? Feeling it’s jumping back and forward? That would indicate a field order problem. Though i’m not even sure that quicktime can show a field order problem on a LCD screen.

A smart trick to check this in FCP: Take a bit on the time line, and reduce speed to 50% with frame blending on. Now go frame by frame through the clip. If you see the jumping back and forward effect, the field order is wrong. If it just goes slower the field order is correct.

Last, if you want to deliver a smooth quicktime without interlace lines, you DO have to de-interlace the movie.