Do i still need an editing card??

[Ryan Holmes]

For editing 5DIII footage and EX1 footage you will be fine as is. You don’t need another card.

However, I would recommend getting an Nvidia based graphics card instead of the ATI one you listed. Adobe built it’s Mercury Playback Engine for Nvidia graphics cards. ATI’s will work with Premiere but you won’t get the performance boost of the Mercury Playback Engine.

Ryan Holmes
http://www.ryanholmes.me
@CutColorPost

[Tom Daigon]

+1.

Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
http://www.hdshotsandcuts.com
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxPrG3WUyz8
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HP Z820 Dual 2687
64GB ram
Dulce DQg2 16TB raid

[Alex Gerulaitis]

[Ryan Holmes] “For editing 5DIII footage and EX1 footage you will be fine as is. You don’t need another card.”

Unless you are submitting your output for broadcast (or 24p BD) and need to be 100% sure that occasional jerkiness of the video is the result of 24p-to-whatever-the-display-monitor-frequency-is translation and not something in actual video?

Am I way off thinking that with graphics-card-based-monitoring, there is no way to display 24p as smoothly as with video I/O and a broadcast monitor with native 24p, or at least a TV with a pull-down?

[Ryan Holmes]

[Alex Gerulaitis] “Am I way off thinking that with graphics-card-based-monitoring, there is no way to display 24p as smoothly as with video I/O and a broadcast monitor with native 24p, or at least a TV with a pull-down?”

Today’s video cards can accurately display footage (23.976, 29.97, 59.94, etc.) to a computer monitor. The caveat being that if what you’re editing is going to broadcast then you should have a broadcast monitor in your pipeline to check for things like proper interlacing, broadcast safe colors, action/title safe, etc.

The OP’s question centered more around “do I need an additional card for proper playback on my computer” – no, he doesn’t. If you’re intended delivery is broadcast, then my answer would be – no, you don’t need an additional card for proper playback, but yes, you will need an additional card for proper monitoring to an external broadcast-quality monitor.

Clear as mud?! 😉

Ryan Holmes
http://www.ryanholmes.me
@CutColorPost

[Alex Gerulaitis]

[Ryan Holmes] “Today’s video cards can accurately display footage (23.976, 29.97, 59.94, etc.) to a computer monitor”

Does Adobe confirm it anywhere? (Don’t mean to doubt your words, just want to be able to back it up.)

Just up until recently (CS5?) even 8-bit color space wasn’t accurately represented with the YUV-to-RGB conversion. Adobe seems to be done away with it and now displays YUV natively, but I don’t see anything to the effect of color accuracy, frame rates, scaling. Far as I can see, I can’t even be sure I get true 1-to-1 unscaled display when I choose full res playback.

Alex Gerulaitis
Systems Engineer
DV411 – Los Angeles, CA

[Ryan Holmes]

Alex – everybody doubts my words! 😉 But that’s how you learn I suppose.

Your question seems to be more with Adobe’s rendering of color space, pixel mapping, etc. than with a video card. I’m only saying that today’s video cards have the capacity to accurately deal with these problems. If there’s something buggy in the software or code of the program then that’s a different story….one that your video card won’t fix since it would b a software-based issue (i.e. FCP, Adobe, Avid, Autodesk, etc. – same video card for all the above apps, but how the app handles/displays/renders your media is up to that software).

I haven’t had any problems with Adobe in this area. Your mileage may vary. If so, it’s probably worth opening a support ticket with Adobe. I’d be curious what they say provided you have a specific, reproducible problem.

Ryan Holmes
http://www.ryanholmes.me
@CutColorPost

[Walter Soyka]

[Alex Gerulaitis] “Just up until recently (CS5?) even 8-bit color space wasn’t accurately represented with the YUV-to-RGB conversion. Adobe seems to be done away with it and now displays YUV natively, but I don’t see anything to the effect of color accuracy, frame rates, scaling. Far as I can see, I can’t even be sure I get true 1-to-1 unscaled display when I choose full res playback.”

Premiere Pro is not color-managed, so accuracy is out. (Ae is color-managed and capable of accurate color on a good, profiled computer monitor.)

Accurate viewing of frame rate will depend at least in part on monitor refresh settings; for most users running at 60 Hz, 24p cannot be perfectly evaluated. There’s no way I know of to accurately monitor interlacing on a computer monitor.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events

[Alex Gerulaitis]

[Walter Soyka] “Premiere Pro is not color-managed, so accuracy is out.”

Thanks Walter. Would that make a good case for still using a video I/O card for those editors who just want to be sure of the WYSIWYG part of monitoring with Pr?

[Walter Soyka] “Accurate viewing of frame rate will depend at least in part on monitor refresh settings; for most users running at 60 Hz, 24p cannot be perfectly evaluated. There’s no way I know of to accurately monitor interlacing on a computer monitor.”

So we have at least two reasons to use a video I/O card for monitoring in Pr:
1. color accuracy
2. frame rate accuracy

Is there a way to force AE to playback at exactly, say, 23.976fps, to a computer monitor? (I am not aware of it.) If not, can we really call AE playback frame accurate? (Video I/O cards can do serve 23.976 up natively and it’s up to the monitor to handle it or not… right?)

It is also my understanding that Pr playback (to a computer monitor) depends on a lot of variables including how the codec handles decoding. I.e. there is no way to be sure that what you see on the computer monitor is actually in the video because:
– the codec may choose to to only serve 1/2 the resolution (the case with some Cineform codecs?),
– the playback mechanism may skip frames without reporting it,
– there is no way to get true 1:1 image (no re-scaling)… ?

Would that make it another good reason one would want a video I/O card with Premiere Pro?

Alex Gerulaitis
Systems Engineer
DV411 – Los Angeles, CA

[Alex Gerulaitis]

[Ryan Holmes] “Your question seems to be more with Adobe’s rendering of color space, pixel mapping, etc. than with a video card.”

My question was more, what are the good reasons to use a video I/O card with Premiere Pro.

If Pr computer monitoring is: (1) not color accurate, (2) not frame accurate, and (3) scaled – that’s three good reasons for it, which answers the OP’s question.

Alex Gerulaitis
Systems Engineer
DV411 – Los Angeles, CA

[Walter Soyka]

[Walter Soyka] “Premiere Pro is not color-managed, so accuracy is out.”

[Alex Gerulaitis] “Thanks Walter. Would that make a good case for still using a video I/O card for those editors who just to be sure of the WYSIWYG part of monitoring with Pr?”

WYSIWYG — sort of. In conjunction with good, calibrated broadcast monitor, what you see will be what you get, but in our crazy world of file-based delivery and non-broadcast presentation, what you give may not be what your audience ultimately sees.

[Alex Gerulaitis] “Is there a way to force AE to playback at exactly, say, 23.976fps, to a computer monitor? (I am not aware of it.) If not, can we really call AE playback frame accurate? (Video I/O cards can do serve 23.976 up natively and it’s up to the monitor to handle it or not… right?)”

If your graphics card and monitor can be made to refresh at some multiple of 23.796/24.0 (72 Hz?), then maybe. I can’t say I’ve tried.

Proper broadcast monitoring via HD-SDI, as you say, will support it.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events