Bizarre audio from Zoom H4n in Vegas

[Scott Simpson]

I use the H4n and have not seen that behaviour myself.

Is this weird audio recorded with the internal mics? The answer wouldn’t make the problem any less weird to me, but it might be more info for someone else.

—
Radio guy in a TV world. Bigasssuperstar.com

[Joe Mizera]

Good point. This was recorded via rec outs to line in on the H4n. This phenomenon has happened on three different boards now.

I’ve yet to do anything with the internal mics.

Joe Mizera
Mizera Digital
https://www.austexvideo.com

[Kelly Griffin]

Hey Jim–

Sounds very much like what I’ve experienced all along with my v10 (tried v12, too, to see if it went away. It didn’t).

It only happens with WAV files (all WAV files), but I’ll get what you get and worse… I’ll get parts of intended audio, then redlining static, then parts of audio that isn’t even in the same project folder.

I have to take EVERYTHING into SoundForge and convert to AIF.

–Kelly

[Bob Peterson]

I have no problems with H4N or WAV files in v12.

[Dave Haynie]

Hmmm… sure looks like something’s wrong with the WAV file formatting. I’ve been using a Zoom H4n regularly, pretty much since them came out (replaced my old Tascam digital recorder), and never had a problem in any version of Vegas.

I can recommend a couple of general things: run the latest H4n firmware, of course. The unit gets noisy if you’re using external mics with phantom power and the battery gets low. If you record from a mixer, watch your levels — most mixers will put out audio at pro +4dBu levels, and the H4n’s line inputs are -12dBV consumer-level inputs, and if you’re running to the XLR jacks, they’re mic level and you’re going to want a pair of 20dB pads.

However, there’s no manner of bad behavior I can think of that would get me the first waveform you’re displaying. Maybe a noise gate with a real slow recovery, or some sort of WAV encoding issue… maybe there’s a bug in the format, particular if you’re running an older version of the H4n firmware. And just to be safe, make sure you’re not running with the limiter or AGC enabled, at least until you verify you’re not running into any weirdness due to those.

If you have Sound Forge, try loading the WAV there. If it plays/displays as expected, write it out to another file.. WAV is ok, since Forge will re-write the file. Try that in Vegas, see if anything changes. I have an old Sanyo FH1 I bought for crashcam use (before the Heros got good), and while this does a decent job, it records in an MP4 wrapper, sometimes with a corrupted timecode. Vegas always crashed on that timecode (haven’t tried it lately), which is not a huge shock — the job of an NLE is to rapidly process correct assets, not to take the time to assume every asset might be corrupt. Anyway, running that through a program that generated a new MP4 wrapper solved the problem. That’s basically what Forge, or some other audio program (even Audacity) might do for you here, if the problem is Vegas not understanding these files.

However, as said, I have never had a problem with the H4n. I’m running a recent but not absolute latest build of the firmware.

-Dave

[Joe Mizera]

Thanks for all the responses. I did pull the wav into Sound Forge. A very old version, but works fine for me. It too displays a periodic pattern on the waveform, but seems to be able to play it ok.

By the way, a pad was used, and no compression, limiting, lo cut, etc.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/kw4eqseuc89ubh7/Screenshot%202014-04-30%2009.55.40.png

I did try outputting as AIFF, and the same results occurred. I did do the bios update (was 1.60 now 1.72) and so far have been unable to duplicate the problem. Just recording of a tablet with music and tones for test. The only other variable is that these were very long recordings, nearly three hours in length. Going to try this next just to see.

Joe Mizera
Mizera Digital
https://www.austexvideo.com

[Antonio Salva]

Yes, I have this exact problem, I too use an H4n, I also have this problem when I import audio from a CD via Vegas, I just upgraded to version 12. At first I thought this may be a problem with my hard drive, I wrote a post titled “jumbled audio on USB 3 drive” and only had one response talking about corrupted sf files. But I knew this wasn’t the case because I imported the audio via CD capture twice and have same problem that you have. Is this a known glitch in Vegas 12 or is it possibly a setting on the USB 3 drive. Are you using a USB 3 drive? How.can importing WAV files be a problem when the CD capture renders the file. Will Mr. Rofano please give some insight, he seems to know Vegas as well as anyone. I’m a little worried because I do music videos and use WAV files constantly from the H4n and other sources.

[Joe Mizera]

Antonio, as to your question, I used USB 2, both in a card reader, and direct connection to the H2n. Same problem. After the firmware update, I did some short recordings, and they came out fine. When I did a long recording, about two hours 45 in this latest test, the problem is back. The length of the wav recording has something to do with it. Whether the problem is Vegas, or the Zoom, is still unclear to me.

I’m going to do the same length recording in Mp3, and see if the results are the same. If I have to default to Mp3 recording, that would be a bit of a bummer. Even at 320, it’s still compressed.

Joe Mizera
Mizera Digital
https://www.austexvideo.com

[Antonio Salva]

Dave, can you tell us about your setup. I too am having problems playing WAV files. Even WAV files created bySony Vegas via CD capture within the program. I have also read another post that has this same problem. I installed Vegas Pro 12 hoping all the kinks would have been worked out by the last version. This is really frustrating because I can’t work on projects with this glitch. My videos play perfect and the audio accompanying them. When I add a WAV file the sound is a jumbled mess. Is this something new or has there been any reports of these problems in the past. It seems to happen when I use an external drive, and only WAV files. Tell us more how you have your computer set up with any changes to preferences or bios that may affect how WAV files are played back, or any soundcard changes ie buffer sizes etc Thanx Tony

[Dave Haynie]

[Antonio Salva] “Dave, can you tell us about your setup. I too am having problems playing WAV files. Even WAV files created bySony Vegas via CD capture within the program. I have also read another post that has this same problem. I installed Vegas Pro 12 hoping all the kinks would have been worked out by the last version. This is really frustrating because I can’t work on projects with this glitch”

Understand the frustration. I can’t say I have a clue about the solution. But here’s my setup:

Intel i7-3930K processor, 64GB DDR3 DRAM, 960GB SSD main drive, ~6GB RAID10 data drive, AMD Radeon HD6970 GPU, 2x 1440p + 1x 1200p monitors, external 12TB Drobo on Firewire 800. Dozens of USB ports via multiple 12-way USB 2.0 and one four-way USB 3.0 ports.

About once a season I do a recording of one of the “jam” groups I play with using the H4n, and various others at more random times. That’s usually 3-4 hours of sound, 4-channel (two stereo WAV files), 48kHz/24-bit, using internal mics and usually two external dynamic mics. For video projects, I generally set the Zoom up the same way, setting it “free running”, so it functions as a time base for cameras that are constantly getting turned on and off (DSLRs in particular). Running System 1.70, Version 1.01, on the Zoom.

What else… no CODEC packs installed, tons of software for internet, EE CAD, music, photography, etc. I run smart but not light… I haven’t found it that easy to screw up Vegas. You mentioned Vegas 13 Demo does the same thing? I was planning to ask if you tried re-installing, just for grins, but figured you did if you’re trying the Vegas 13 demo/purchased.

You can drop me one of the offending files (davehaynie@gmail.com on DropBox will work) and I’ll give a try here. That might at least tell you if the mutation is file-based or Vegas-based, but given that it plays in other things, you may have established that already.

-Dave