[Ty Ford]

Hello Josh and welcome to the Cow Audio Forum.

Remember the Mac audio utility program? (Not the preferences panel)

It has some surprises for you.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

Thanks John,

I reviewed the 1800 about six months or so ago and found it a pretty nice unit. The scanner is not as smart as it could be, but that’s probably true for all of us. 🙂

I’d say use the U100 until they don’t work. AT says the receivers need to be a bit apart so as not to interfere with each other, but I’ve had my two about six inches a[art and not noticed anything peculiar.

There’s one chap up in the NW somewhere who says he hears when the antennae switch, but I have only heard that when the units are really stretching for range.

Where did you find the deals on them?

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

[John Hartney] “I’ve read on the web these discountinued U100 series components are quieter and cleaner sounding than the new 1800 series. Any opinions?”

Hi John,

I’d be interested in exactly where you heard/saw this.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

Hello John and welcome to the Cow Audio Forum,

I have two pair of these and actually the mic that comes with them (the little paddle mics) are really quite good and are a very good match for the body transmitters. Which mics are you using?

Please check your manual. To my knowledge, the transmitter light comes on and then goes off until the batteries weaken, then it comes back on so you can visually inspect the transmitter and see it need new batteries when the light is on. OTHO, the receiver LED lights up with power and stays on until power start to fail and then it dims. Yes?

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

Hello Ham and welcome to the Cow Audio Forum.

I have not used this device yet. I do know that Audio Technica has just put out the AT2020 USB mic (about $150 street). If your computer already has audio software, all you have to do is plug the mic into A USB port on your computer and choose it from your audio control panel.

To hear what the mic sounds like, take a trip over to my online archive and look in the AT2020USB folder. From your inquiry, I think this may be a good choice for you.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

Hello David,

In (way too many) conversations with company reps, I have asked that and several other questions about camera audio and have received pretty much the same answer.

1. In a professional world where 16- bit, 48kHz stereo audio is baseline MINIMUM these days, why are cameras still at that spec? Why can’t we at least have 24-bit, 48 kHz? It has LONG been proven that well-implemented 24-bit audio is substantially better than 16-bit. Especially in the field, 24-bit audio allows a wider variance of unexpectedly low levels to sound good back in postproduction.

1a. How did the spec for HDV audio EVER get set at MPEG audio that is 1/5 the data rate of 16-bit, 48 kHz?

2. Why are camera headphone outputs frequently underpowered and distorted.

3. Why aren’t all camera headphone outputs stereo. With many, you can hear left, right or a mono mix of both.

The answers I have been given have ranged from unsympathetic shoulder shrugs to the comment that, for the best audio, we should double record.

Personally, I think the real deal is that camera mfgrs are so focused (pun intended) about getting the video right, that they don’t want to hear about audio.

Technical reps from manufacturers (among others) become part of standards committees. These standards committees wrestle over the specs and how best to implement them. If there are any audiocentric members of these committees, I presume they get gagged at some point while the video members try to figure out how to make, yet, another compressed video format. Higher bit rate audio, of course, would eat into the video data stream.

As to the where and why not of regularly implemented, 4-channel (and pitiful) 16-bit, 48 kHz audio, fine, I have no problem with cameras that make the 3 + 4 channels part of an optional package. There are only so many XLR connectors you can punch into the case of a camera body before structural integrity is compromised. (Besides, with the major attention on video, the importance of placement of audio circuits in cameras is usually secondary or tertiary, resulting in less than ideal S/N figures.)

I don’t really “buy” the position that good audio circuits can’t be put into cameras. Quality components and proper shielding are required. With today’s SMT (surface mount technology) there is no reason why good audio circuits can’t be designed and implemented……well, other than the videocentric attitudes of camera makers.

It’s about money, and camera makers being deathly afraid that their new cameras will not be adopted by the large volume buyers. Competition is fierce. I am sympathetic. What goes on behind closed doors when camera makers try to sell the new gear to networks isn’t pretty. It’s like being in the closing cell of a used car dealership.

How would the hardware work? In the analog world, we’d need to accept a new connector format, most likely a fanout of four solid TA3 connectors with a dedicated, 5-pin TA5, 4 channel headphone return. That would mean adapters for all existing gear and new mixers and snakes for everyone. Maybe digital mixers could implement existing MADI technology. Still that’s a major revolution and it won’t come cheaply. Impossible? No. Not likely to happen due to the status quo? Pretty much.

Want to nudge this along? Feel free to copy and paste this post as much as you’d like to as many places as you’d like and add whatever features you think deserve it. Change will only come if the wheel squeeks get loud enough.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

Hello David,

In (way too many) conversations with company reps, I have asked that and several other questions about camera audio and have received pretty much the same answer.

1. In a professional world where 16- bit, 48kHz stereo audio is baseline MINIMUM these days, why are cameras still at that spec? Why can’t we at least have 24-bit, 48 kHz? It has LONG been proven that well-implemented 24-bit audio is substantially better than 16-bit. Especially in the field, 24-bit audio allows a wider variance of unexpectedly low levels to sound good back in postproduction.

1a. How did the spec for HDV audio EVER get set at MPEG audio that is 1/5 the data rate of 16-bit, 48 kHz?

2. Why are camera headphone outputs frequently underpowered and distorted.

3. Why aren’t all camera headphone outputs stereo. With many, you can hear left, right or a mono mix of both.

The answers I have been given have ranged from unsympathetic shoulder shrugs to the comment that, for the best audio, we should double record.

Personally, I think the real deal is that camera mfgrs are so focused (pun intended) about getting the video right, that they don’t want to hear about audio.

Technical reps from manufacturers (among others) become part of standards committees. These standards committees wrestle over the specs and how best to implement them. If there are any audiocentric members of these committees, I presume they get gagged at some point while the video members try to figure out how to make, yet, another compressed video format. Higher bit rate audio, of course, would eat into the video data stream.

As to the where and why not of regularly implemented, 4-channel (and pitiful) 16-bit, 48 kHz audio, fine, I have no problem with cameras that make the 3 + 4 channels part of an optional package. There are only so many XLR connectors you can punch into the case of a camera body before structural integrity is compromised. (Besides, with the major attention on video, the importance of placement of audio circuits in cameras is usually secondary or tertiary, resulting in less than ideal S/N figures.)

I don’t really “buy” the position that good audio circuits can’t be put into cameras. Quality components and proper shielding are required. With today’s SMT (surface mount technology) there is no reason why good audio circuits can’t be designed and implemented……well, other than the videocentric attitudes of camera makers.

It’s about money, and camera makers being deathly afraid that their new cameras will not be adopted by the large volume buyers. Competition is fierce. I am sympathetic. What goes on behind closed doors when camera makers try to sell the new gear to networks isn’t pretty. It’s like being in the closing cell of a used car dealership.

How would the hardware work? In the analog world, we’d need to accept a new connector format, most likely a fanout of four solid TA3 connectors with a dedicated, 5-pin TA5, 4 channel headphone return. That would mean adapters for all existing gear and new mixers and snakes for everyone. Maybe digital mixers could implement existing MADI technology. Still that’s a major revolution and it won’t come cheaply. Impossible? No. Not likely to happen due to the status quo? Pretty much.

Want to nudge this along? Feel free to copy and paste this post as much as you’d like to as many places as you’d like and add whatever features you think deserve it. Change will only come if the wheel squeeks get loud enough.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

In addition to the author’s copyright, there are other rights. From the Harry Fox Agency web site, the definitions of the terms below may help you understand the intricacies.

When you look at the degree of legal exposure you and/or your client may have, it becomes instantly understandable why production music companies exist. They serve a very good purpose. 5Alarm, Network, DeWolfe to name three exist to provide quality music for video productions.

Garage Band and Acid Loops are music toolkits that allow the user to build their own tracks, but to do it right, you need a sense of composition otherwise your “music tracks” aren’t very musical.

You may have composers in your own town who can do quality work. There are on line services that allow composers to bid on projects as submitted by clients. You may be on the other side of the planet from each other.

If you underestimate the importance of music or overestimate your production chops, your pride may be served, but your productions will suffer.

I’ve been writing about music rights and creating music tracks for years now. I’m not a symphonic composer by any means. Most of my tracks are underscores for commercials or medium form marketing videos. I know where my limitations are and I know when to say, “Sorry what you want is beyond my abilities. Try this or that person.”

Regards,

Ty Ford

Harry Fox Definitions

Mechanical Rights
A mechanical right is the right to record and distribute (without visual images) a song on a phonorecord for private use. Mechanical rights or a mechanical license must be obtained in order to lawfully make and distribute records, CD’s and tapes. Recording rights for most music publishers can be obtained from

The Harry Fox Agency
205 East 42nd Street
New York, New York 10017
212-370-5330
https://www.nmpa.org/hfa.html

Sync rights: Synchronization or “Synch” Rights
A synchronization or “synch” right involves the use of a recording of musical work in audio-visual form: for example as part of a motion picture, television program, commercial announcement, music video or other videotape. Often, the music is “synchronized” or recorded in timed relation with the visual images. Synchronization rights are licensed by the music publisher to the producer of the movie or program.

Public Performance or Performance Rights
A public performance is one that occurs “in a place open to the public or at any place where a substantial number of persons outside of a normal circle of a family and its social acquaintances is gathered.” A public performance also occurs when the performance is transmitted by means of any device or process (for example, via broadcast, telephone wire, or other means) to the public. In order to perform a copyrighted work publicly, the user must obtain performance rights from the copyright owner or his representative.

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[Ty Ford]

An elegant solution, however, given the price of the HDX900, you could buy 4 744ts.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

Hi Ron, Jan, et al,

I’ve only seen 4 channel backs for a few Sony cameras (I think there are 4 ch backs for Sony Digibeta camcorders, maybe just for certain models), but Jan knows the Panasonic line very well. I don’t. (Nice to see you here, Jan.)

You can get 4 channel operation in some lesser cameras but the audio becomes problematic because it’s not 16-bit, 48 kHz. Some NLE just dn’t know what to do with the audio.

David Jones has the best solution here, double record. My Sound Devices 744T records polywave files. That means you get all four tracks showing up as one file icon, drag it drop it and all four channels are on the time line all synced up. Pretty cool.

To James Cordell; Jim, do you really need 4 tracks? What are you trying to do?

Regards,

Ty Ford

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