[Ty Ford]

Hello Tyler and welcome to the Cow Audio Forum.

I was expecting the worst. When I heard her, I thought, “Hey, I’ve heard a lot worse than this on the air.”

Sibilance is defined as the S, Z, Ch sounds. You need some sibilance. Overly sibilant speech does get distracting. She could be just That Way and nobody ever called her on it. I’ve had women here at my studio with too much sibilance. it’s about where the tip of the tongue ends up behind the upper front teeth. Put the tongue some place else, and the problem goes away.

For you, at this point, there are several fixes. A de-esser or hand editing. Or, If you go into the file and zoom in on the offending parts, you’ll see the waveform is a LOT denser on the overly sibilant areas. grab the denser area and reduce it’s volume by 6 dB, 10, dB, maybe even 12dB.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

[Scott Jensen] “I looked at the preamp

https://www.sounddevices.com/products/usbpremaster.htm

but couldn’t download Adobe Reader, to read the PDF on it.

>>Can’t help you there.

Questions:

1. If I feed two separate signals into the xlr inputs of the Sound Devices preamp will it output two separate channels (tracks?) of audio simultaneously via the USB?

>>Yes

2. Will Adobe Premiere recognize it as two tracks and not one mixed track.

>>That depends on your computer and on Premiere.

If not

3. How can the other Sound Devices digital outputs (ports marked S/PDIF, PC audio) be captured onto my notebook? Some sort of adapter? My notebook only has firewire and USB and the analog MIC input.

>>Unless your computer sound card has S/PDIF ports, you can’t use S/PDIF. I don’t know what PC audio refers to. Call SOund Devices today and tell them what you want to do. See what tey say.

4. I don’t think two separate digital streams can be captured by a notebook? “
>>Two streams? as in from two physical connectors? Not without a hardware interface of some sort.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

[Nicholas Canavan] “Thanks again Ty,

Is there any way at all to pad the camera sound? Could i do something like put foam etc over the FX1e’s microphone?

>>>Hey Nick, a and might seem to be something like that, but it’s actually a resistance that gets put in line with the signal to knock it down some. Now that we’ve been talking about it for a while, it occurs to me that this happened on a shoot I was doing sound for this past summer. On this occasion, we were on a facility where they reconditioned APCs (Armored Personnel Carriers) for the Army. The shooter wanted to get in the turret and shoot while the tank was in motion. Space was an issue, so he went alone. Before he left he said the camera mic levels were pegging and handed me his camera. (Note: His camera.) I could find no adjustments to reduce the mic sensitivity. He said, “This is a frequently used model of camera. You should know the menus!.” Because I was working on contract though another entity, I decided not to respond with, “It’s YOUR camera, and you don’t know the menus!?”

>>>At lunch I suggested we take another look. He spun through the menus and we never did find any adjustments. The APC was just too loud for the camera mics. In retrospect, I could have connected my Sound Devices mixer to the camera and we would have been OK because it has THAT amount of control. Bottom line: camera mics are designed to work over a range of sound pressure. The environment you’re in is above that range.

I bought the marantzpmd660 because i thought it was a proffesional unit that can do the job well..maybe its not. What would be a better option if i had to buy again?

>>>I see Oade has some suggestions for the 660 that you may not have gotten around to googling:
https://www.oade.com/digital_recorders/hard_disc_recorders/PMD-660MODS.html

I like the Sound Devices recorders and mixers.

All things considered, what is the best type of source from a live desk? A XLR mic input or a rca line? I have a pad for a mic input and the marantz has an -20db cut option..

>>>Again, you’re talking about connectors and not the levels themselves. The connectors are just plumbing. It’s the signal on them that counts. Take the XLR. It could be mic or line level balanced audio or unbalanced stereo at any level you can imagine. You just have to deal with it when you show up. If it’s a critical gig. Hire a location audio sound person with some experience in live sound hook ups. They usually have a box of converters and pads to fit a variety of occasions.

Typically, you want a signal that won’t change in level. If you don’t, you may start the night with a good signal, but if the desk operator begins to push the system, there, go your levels. So what you want to get is a pre-fader mix. That means a mix of the audio before it hits the faders ( that he/she may be adjusting). Not all desks give you that. Not all operators know how to give you that.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

“My suggestion is the 2TK return input/s with a feed from the camera.”

Careful in choosing what audio output you choose from the camera. The headphone output is designed with an impedance and level to drive headphones.
If you drive another audio stage like a tape input with a headphone output, the level and impedance mismatches could result in a change in frequency response and/or distortion.

If the camera has -10 prosumer level outputs, though, it might work if you could run that one input to the mixer’s headphone out all by itself.

Your 302 is looking better all the time.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

[Scott Jensen] “After further research I’ll probably be getting a Sennheiser MKH 416 that’ll work for now and should match

the quality of the someday to be unleashed Red Scarlet. Based on the MP3 recordings of the Sennheiser I’ve heard it sounds great.

Some forum indicated that the Red One does better with a line level input, I’m guessing because thats

because the internal camcorder preamp gets bypassed? Assuming (big assumption) that the Red

Scarlet has similar audio recording capablities, I should look for a preamp with line level ouptut…

>>>The difficult part is making a mic preamp in a camera that doesn’t pickup noise from other camera parts. The current RED has low level noise problems and some new boards are being sent to some people. That’s what I heard last week down in DC from a RED owner.

1. Do all standalone preamps put out line level signal?
>Pretty much. That’s what a preamp does.
2. What is the port/connector/cable called that uses line level signal
>The “plumbing” varies by make and model. XLR, 1/4″ TRS are the usual.
3. Is there a standalone preamp that puts out both line level signal and a usb signal?

I couldn’t find one that does both.
>https://www.sounddevices.com/products/usbpremaster.htm

I know you recommended the Sound devices 302, but its kinda expensive…

4. Is there a preamp with usb and line level signal output that matches the quality of the Sennheiser MKH 416 that
does both USB and line level signal output? Preferably one under $500.
>https://www.sounddevices.com/products/usbpremaster.htm

5. If I am recording to my notebook (with the previosly mentioned recording equipment) and am listening to the recording (after capture) via analog headphones
will I be hearing the full quality?

I’m guessing no.
> Depends on how good your headphones and headphone amps are.

6. The digital to analog conversion in the notebook is bad?
>Compared to what? Listen and find out.

7. Is there a digital headphone that when used with my notebook would represent the recorded signal? Make, Model?
>At some point the audio has to be converted to analog so you can hear it, as such, there really aren’t any digital headphones unless they have a built in D/A converter. I haven’t seen any yet.

8.I am guessing the bit depth, and freq. response of the digital hardware are not so good in the notebook? ”
>Compared to what? The converters in my Mac Ti book were really better than I expected.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

Hello Tom and welcome to the Cow Audio Forum.

Keep it simple. If the yamaha mixer doesn’t have return capabilities, plug headphones into the camera.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

Hello Nicholas,

I think you need to figure out how to get the audio from the desk into your recorder without distorting. Pick another output and see if that works. Line and mic levels are standard. As I metioned, the -10 is in between. Maybe your recorder isn’t really pro line level, maybe it’s -10.

The camera audio would also be helpful to fill in the sound. Here, you need to figure out how to pad the level down so it doesn’t distort.

Sounds like you’re doing the right things. I know it’s frustrating, but this is sort of difficult to fix from across the Internet.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

Hello NIcholas,

Somewhere in the bowels of the FX1 is a software switch for mic or line.

I’m guessing your camera is set to mic and the console feed is set to line. There is a third level, prosumer, that is between the -40 dB of mic and the 0 of line. Prosumer is -10 dB.

You need to find out what’s feeding what and adjust accordingly. That’s your first problem. Your second problem is that using just a board recording will not sound right because you are only hearing the miced and direct sounds, without the sound of the room/club.

Here’s a youtube clip I shot and recorded. I used a combination of the board mix and the camera mic. The camera mic picks up the sound of the room, the overall sound. The board mix let’s you hear the detail.

This is still a compromise, but it works OK. Not great, but OK. In the real world, you’d have a multi-track recorder with enough tracks for the entire band and some room/audience mics. You’d shoot and record and then do a mix later in a proper studio environment. They took my advice and did that for the Subdudes new DVD. https://www.biographicadocs.com/featurefilms_3.html

I haven’t heard the DVD yet, but the band is happy with the mix.

Just added to this post: Here’s a clip from the DVD. I only did the interview audio on this clip. The music is from their CD and the unplugged music room set. That set only used three mics. Two TLM 103 at a distance and a 414 closer for the main vocals. Not ideal, but for a casual unplugged set, it works.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TH-u9e_7DPM

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

“Thanks so much for your input. After reading your post and further research on the net I’ve learned the Canon HV20 really needs a preamp and the Juicedlink cx231 seems to be whats needed.

>>>Scott, my own preference, although it costs more would be for a Sound Devices 302.
https://www.sounddevices.com/products/302master.htm
Much better design and one that will provide years of service. Don’t think of it in “camera years”, where the camera will be out of date in 18 months, or less. Good audio gear has a MUCH longer usable life.

Since the Juicedlink provides phantom power it could potentially be used with a high quality studio condenser mics (Rode nt1a) for recording to the camcorder. Yes?

>>>Yes. The Rode NT1a is an OK studio mic, but I don’t consider it a high quality condenser mic. What you you want to record with it?

I guess my goal in wanting to record everything to HDV tape is to eliminate one piece of equipment (the Centrance preamp). And archiving to tape is a benefit over hard drive.

Question:

1. Is the HDV audio recording specification sufficient to record VO say with the Juicedlink and the Rode nt1a? In other words is the HDV tape a limiting factor?

>>>The audio spec for HDV is limited to 384 kbps stereo MPEG; about 1/5 the data of even a CD. That’s one of the reasons I lagged back and bought a Canon XL2 4 years ago. The audio was just not up to snuff. Regardless of that, some people use HDV audio.

I see the specs for the Centrance are 24 bit @ 96khz.
I can’t find the specs for the Canon HV20 audio bit depth and sample rate

>>> BRB…..from the Canon site.
DV: 16 bit (2ch) 48 kHz
12 bit (4ch) 32 kHz
4ch synchronous recording not possible
HDV: MPEG1 Audio Layer II (2 ch)

The above specs form the Canon site confirm that HDV audio is MPEG 1 Layer II. Curiously, It does not specify the data rate. I think you will find that the data rate is as I quoted 384 kbps stereo.

Also note that the DV audio rate is shown as 16-bit 48 kHz; slightly better than CD, but dependent on how well the audio section is designed. Because the audio input is unbalanced, you’re starting out with a liability.

Some years back when the first Sony HDV cameras came out, I called Sony and spoke to one of their engineers about the MPEG audio. In a technical world in which specs are supposed to get better and better, why would anyone want a spec that was 1/5 the data rate of CDs!?

The HDV format is a collection of data compression compromises, both audio and video. They (not just Sony, but whomever was involved with the spec, Sony included) chose to rob Peter to pay Paul. They needed as much technical space as possible to achieve the video they wanted, so they skrimped the space from the audio.

There were also latency issues. Data compression results in latency (delay). In order to have the picture and sound sync up properly, delay had to be added to the audio to sync it to the highly compressed, delayed video. Arguably, one way to do this would be to data compress the audio to a point that would delay the audio so that it would sync to the compressed HDV video. And there you have it!

The Sony rep agreed with me that, if really good audio is what you want, you need to double record. That is, record audio separately on a system with a higher quality audio spec.

Have a great weekend,

Regards,

Ty Ford

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[Ty Ford]

Hello Scott and welcome to the Cow Audio Forum

1. Does the Centrance provide enough gain for the Shure SM7B(60 db?)for notebook computer recording? Is it adequate for voiceover work?

For close micing VO work, yes. I ran a MicPort Pro here with a sennheiser 421. They are similarly sensitive. Here’s my published review.
https://www.dv.com/reviews/reviews_item.php?articleId=196604261

2. I think I’ll need some xlr to miniplug adaptor to use the Shure with my HV20 camcorder?

A standard female XLR to 1/8″ TRS will not work. You need a special female XLR to male 1/8″ TRS cable. You need one that puts the mic signal to both tip and ring. You want this one:
https://www.trewaudio.com/store/product.php?productid=146&cat=21&page=1

3. Will my camcorders handle the Shure SM7B microphone input? In other words will the camcorder know how much to preamplify the signal from the Shure mic?

The question is whether the HV20 mic preamp has enough quiet gain to do the job. No one can tell you that until you try it.

4. Does the porta booth really work as advertised.

There are several of these contraptions on the market. They may help to a degree, but nothing takes the place of a proper recording environment.

5. Is there a way to mount a MIC such as the Shure SM7B to my camcorder ”

Rube Goldberg makes a mount :), but the SM7B is designed to work at a distance of 4 to 6 inches. Mounting it on a camera would not be a good application.

Regards,

Ty Ford

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