David Cherniack
Forum Replies Created
-
[MoonLitNite] ” I’m unaware of the factual basis that PP throughput is limited by a 32 bit OS architecture”
Adobe is well aware of it. The main problem seems to be how the app uses memory. Matrox provides a utility for monitoring PPro’s memory use. It gobbles ram with time and doesn’t give it all back. The limit of 3GB per app in XP becomes a problem fairly quickly with complicated projects. A 64 bit OS would only solve the existing problem by throwing more than 3GB of ram at it.
David
AllinOneFilms.com -
[MoonLitNite] “Actually, an Adobe executive would have the heads of software or marketing managers who attempted recoding an application that wouldn’t have a payback for over 5 years (to say nothing about trying to hit a moving target of OS API specs) when they could be adding current features/function/bug fixes in the short term to keep ahead of the competition. And even today, I’m sure Adobe’s marketing and product management is doing a careful cost/benefit analysis vis-a-vis the competition in prioritizing the release of a 64 bit Vista release of Premiere Pro. We’ve recently seen a resegmented spin-off of Audition to SoundBooth and Adobe has recently acquired Serious Magic (including the awesome DV Rack) so perhaps there’s still more important fish to fry then a 64 bit Vista port – at least for some of us!
Perhaps I’m among the dumb fools, but having managed and made the “software sausage,” I’d be the last to judge Adobe harshly.”
Hi Michael,
While you make some informed points about software development there remains the issue of whether Adobe should be judged harshly for the development path of Premiere Pro.
The present state of affairs, from the perspective of someone doing effects intensive, large projects, for broadcast, is that Adobe have engineered a product that systematically crashes under WinXP32 for lack of resources – a product that is almost impossible to use for such projects without substantial, inefficient, workarounds.
Perhaps, as you point out, it would have been unfeasable for them to have had a development path that made it easy to provide a 64 bit solution, but given that they almost certainly knew the strain that the product would create on XP32 bit resources, was it then irresponsible of them to release it into the market and claim that it was for professional users, without any caveats whatsoever? Or is my assumption that they were aware of it’s resource useage weaknesses incorrect? Either way I believe they can be held accountable as the resources problems surfaced with 1.0 and two major releases later, they have not been properly addressed. That fact alone inclines me to believe that they hope to sidestep the fix with a 64 bit version. Either that or perhaps they hope to migrate us to the Mac version, which, I’m told, will not suffer the same resources problem as under XP32. It seems to me that no matter which way you cut it they have not yet shown any real concern for the numbers of users like myself who suffer from their engineering decisions.
Not judged harshly? Tell someone that after a day of having to restart PPro 15-20 times in front of a client. As for me? I learned, painfully, how to reduce my restarts to under 5 a day, and my lost time to under a half hour. But I still regularly join the chant of users turning the air blue in Adobe’s direction on a daily basis. If the energy behind all those invectives could be harnassed you could probably run a small city.
David
AllinOneFilms.com -
Bill,
That’s very interesting. I wonder if it was more the 4GB of ram than XP64 that solved your problems. I also wonder how well the Axio drivers would work. Worth investigating between projects.
David
AllinOneFilms.com -
[Steven L. Gotz] “You might want to consider that some of your problems are Matrox based”
Most assuredly some are but in the sense that Axio has intensive resource usage, as well. Mostly though, they’re Premiere based flakiness that necessitates a restart. Matrox gives Axio a little memory based utility that allows the monitoring of memory use by PPro. It’s a steady climb as you work.
David
AllinOneFilms.com -
[Steven L. Gotz] “Do you mean HD or HDV? Are you editing native HDV? If so, I can see where you would hate the program. Without Cineform Aspect HD, I would probably be tearing my hair out by the roots.”
I’m editing HDV but on an AxioHD system which makes it an even greater joy (for me) than Aspect/Prospect.
For those unaware of what Axio can do with HDV you should journey over to the Matrox site. In an nutshell you get multiple channels of realtime with effects including excellent CC, secondary CC, chromakey etc. all converted in realtime to HDSDI. IOW you get the storage advantages of HDV and the output advantages of uncompressed.
David
AllinOneFilms.com -
[Steven L. Gotz] “Perhaps my frustration is showing. I apologize. I just get tired of hearing people blast Adobe for not supporting a new OS that just came out this week.”
No problem, Steven.
I wasn’t at all suggesting that Adobe support Vista 64 out of the chute, only that they probably have planned (or should have planned) to support it through their development process. I expect the next version might support it given the howling that I see on some private lists. At least I hope so. Even though I do take steps to avoid the memory issue, some things, like long timeline renders in HD, just cause it grief. I’ll gladly trade a little slowdown for less restarts.
David
AllinOneFilms.com -
[Steven L. Gotz] “In the meantime, if you want to change to some other program, feel free to do so.”
Steven, if this statement was intended for me, I do. I also feel free to criticize the engineering of PPro. There are a whole bunch of high end users out there who suffer memory/resource related crashes in front of clints that are so plentiful that it’s embarassing. Many of them would switch in a heartbeat.
David
AllinOneFilms.com -
[Vincent Becquiot] “but expecting PP2 to work on it the day Vista is released”
Who said that? Al I said was, given the resourses useage of PPro that I would have expected the Adobe engineers to incorporate plans for 64 bit Windows when they coded version 1.0.
David
AllinOneFilms.com -
[Harm Millaard] “That is your bad luck that you bought it 18 month ago. It is way too slow to run Vista efficiently now with the currently available hardware and you probably paid way too much as well. Technically your system is already outdated.”
That’s rather presumtuous and ignorant. It’s a dual-dual core opteron 275 with 3gb of ram. It’ll run Vista 64 bit without a shudder. Whether I paid too much for it is not the isuue. It’s one of the approved systems for Axio.
You are correct in the sense that by the time Adobe and Matrox release 64 bit versions of their software it well may be outdated. But for me the cost of a new system will be far outweighed by the joy of running a version of PPro that doesn’t waste my time with resource related restarts and crashes.
David
AllinOneFilms.com -
The only things out of this world here are your analogies.
The pathway to 64 bit Windows was well charted by Microsoft at the time PPro was coded. It would have been common practice to take it into account when coding a new application.
[Harm Millaard] “Is your PC ready to run the kind of OS we may have in 2020??? I doubt it.”
It’s not 2020. It’s 2007 and my PC is ready to run 64 bit Vista with no problem. That’s one of the reasons I bought it. 18 months ago.
David
AllinOneFilms.com