[Carsten Orlt]

As Jeremy nicely puts it: I fell the need to response and go through Scots post point for point.

[Scott Sheriff] “The whole “storyteller” and “artist” paradigm is getting overplayed, and tired. It’s straight out of the ‘Stereotypes R Us’ catalog. Do you wear a beret when you edit?
From that couple of paragraphs, I can only imagine you are either 80 years old, and with so few years left you don’t think your career will advance beyond your current needs before you assume room temp…
Or
Your career path is pretty much YT, or Vimeo art/hobby pieces, and you don’t see a future where anything other than the basics, or any type of collaborative effort will be required. Sort of like a video version of Lomography. “

Ok you know what I think of this part 🙂

[Scott Sheriff] “These two statements seem to be in direct conflict. You desire that X should never be anything other than some generic, entry level type tool because that’s your speed, so does that me everyone else has to suffer?”

To call FCPx a ‘generic, entry level tool’ is your interpretation. I actually think it is a very well thought out editing tool. If it makes you suffer than don’t use it. If you use it and suffer than I do not have any sympathy because I do not understand why you would use it? Unless of course a client forces you too. Is it what you a fearing?

[Scott Sheriff] “I’m glad that X meets all your current, and future needs. What does that say? Think about that. X hasn’t even been out for a year.
I guess it must be hard for you to understand that there are those of us out there that need, want, and can handle a lot more horsepower than X will ever deliver. And that we have some pretty big investments tied to the apple brand, in both hardware and software, and in that respect apple has let us down, and failed to meet our expectations. This is why we are passionate about this. As a someone that uses FCS, I don’t give a rats ass about X, iMovie, or even Express. Had apple continued with FCS, and simply introduced X into the mix, there wouldn’t be an issue.”

Sounds like Apple came to your shop and cut the power? FCP7 is still working fine on all current Apple hardware and all i/o companies have working drivers. As Walter pointed out Avid and Premiere work just fine on exactly the same hardware. Doesn’t sound to me like big investment in hardware has become non-functional over night. If you want to switch all you need to do is buy some new software. Might be a bit more than an update to FCP8 would have costed you, but hardly the earth shattering ‘I have to replace everything I own’. Only thing that has happened is that Apple didn’t continue a software line. You still can work and have plenty of time to make your current hardware make it’s money and when it is time to buy something new to see what is out there. It took me a year to make the decision that I will not jump ship.

[Scott Sheriff] “Where you, and others like you make your big mistake is acting like those of us that were expecting FCP8, or FCS4 and didn’t get it, want to take your toys away. I’ve never understood this. No one said anything like that. This is a straw man created by fanboys to defend, the undefendable.”

I only did say that I like FCPx and hope Apple will continue with it. I’m not afraid of you, but knowing Apple I can’t be sure what their plans are. Maybe they decide after the storm that the whole NLE thing is too difficult and they drop it altogether. I just wanted to let people on the cow know that there are people out there who like it . Kind of a different perspective to the majority of views. That’s all.

[Scott Sheriff] “Long before movie hero came along there was FC Express, and iMovie. A couple of aps that didn’t have “hundred menus and buttons I will never use”, to use your words. These were perfectly suited for the dilettantes, or hobbyists that wanted to play TV. In all the hundreds (and perhaps thousands) of posts where working editors were pining for this and that to be included in the next version of FCP, you will not find ANY where those that need a full blown editing tool wished to take away choices from those that don’t need anything more than iMovie, or Express. “

Dilettantes, hobbyists wanted to play TV? Again know idea who I am but happy to insult. What goes around comes around. And calling FCPx just like iMovie only shows that you only value something that has a lot of knobs and shining lights. Simplicity is an art, not the expression of amateurs. In fact much harder to achieve than to dazzle with another button here and there. There are of course areas like VFX where you need a lot of functions to get things done. But I clearly stated that this is not what I’m doing. If it is what you are mainly earning your money with you should be very happy about Autodesk because it will be 100 times more capable than FCP ever was to do this kind of work.

[Scott Sheriff] “And for this you’re thankful? I don’t get that. So you’re perfectly happy to support and defend apple, after it has told the folks that helped get them to where they’re at (sales and development wise), we don’t need you, are not going to support you anymore, and you no longer have a choice.
Apple says jump, and the only question the fanboys ask is “how high”? But there are a few of us that refuse to be cattle driven off the edge of the cliff.
IMO, if anything sounds like “nasty my way, or the highway crap”, it is the no notice EOL of FCP, and Express by your beloved apple, leaving the users with X and iMovie being the only choices, other than to migrate. That is ironic. “

I also supported Apple from the beginning. I bought FCP the day it was officially released by Apple. I dropped Avid for it. So please don’t give me your implied ‘you must have been using iMovie before’. The difference is that I stopped long ago to second guess what might come, but only look at was is there. Yes Apple decision was initially confusing and I didn’t know what to think of it. But I took my time and came to the conclusion, after having another look at Avid and Premiere, that I like FCPx best. Does this make me a fanboy? If you want to call it that, sure I’m a fanboy because Apple gives me the tools I like. If they do not to you, dumb them. Don’t let them take away the responsibility for your decision. Stop being the victim and make your own decision.

[Scott Sheriff] “As I said before, no one in this, or any other forum ever once suggested taking away your storytelling tools, but you seem to be perfectly OK with the loss of ours. After all, your subject line says “Thank you Apple – and don’t change course. Please”.
So we bitched about the loss of our tools, the loss of choice, lack of notice, and get zero support from folks like yourself. Besides being perplexed by this attitude, I find it quite distasteful how so many fans of X are not just unsympathetic to the situation other editors and business owners find themselves in, but that they seem to be quite happy about it.”

Where did I say I’m happy that you feel betrayed? Again you projecting your opinion onto me. True I’m unsympathetic about the constant bitching. But I didn’t put this in my post. I actually made an effort not to label anybody who disagree’s with me. I lost thousands of dollars over the last 25 years investing in hardware that suddenly wasn’t working with the latest update of this and that anymore. I could write books about it. But I’m no victim to the development of technology. In the long term I earned way more money than I lost. Experience makes me think 3 times before I spend money these days. If I buy the wrong bit and get caught I might be angry but I do not waste my time crying in front of the manufacturer that led me down. Might be fun to come here and vent and I’m not taking away from this at all as I haven’t called you anything negative. I only pointed out that there can be a positive opinion too.

[Scott Sheriff] “What the heck? As long as you have what you want, who cares about the rest of us? Right?
There are lots of reasons why you should care, but I’ll just pick one.
Past performance is the best indicator of future behavior. They killed Final Cut Server, Shake, Final Cut Express, and of course Final Cut Studio. Some day they’ll kill X too, and leave all the X users high and dry. And they will probably do it without any notice, and when it’s the least convenient for you. And when it happens, you’ll probably have to migrate to not only a new NLE, but a new OS and new hardware. And by then, maybe you’ll have some legacy projects you might need to open, and can’t. Or the codec that all your material is in, won’t run on your new system, etc…
That is the day you will see when this stuff happens to you, why it’s not very lulzy. And when that day comes, I bet you won’t be posting any ‘thank you apple’ notices either.”

Same as you I have lots of FCP7 projects and I’m as you effected by the EOL here. Just my conclusion is different. And I prepared long time ago for being able to avoid being solely depending on one software. I invested in a DAM (CatDV as FCP server wasn’t right for my small shop) This gives a true independence from needing to do all media management in an NLE and does a lot of things much better than any NLE currently is capable of. Including FCPx. So the day has already come and I posted after the event.

Cheers
Carsten

[Carsten Orlt]

[Herb Sevush] “While Scott may have gone a little overboard”

A little overboard? Calling me an 80 year old short of getting to the point of being at room temperature is a little overboard? Herb you might be angry but please think before you defend something that is beyond rational.

I happily take responsibility for my opinion. That’s why I posted it, right?

But according to your logic this forum exchange only allows for your point of view because if I say my opinion I declare everyone else’s non valid? You can’t be serious? Because if you think about it than your opinion [Herb Sevush] “is actually an expression of glee at “ my problem….

[Carsten Orlt]

What I don’t understand is why you are so angry that you have to throw around insults after insult just because I stated my personal opinion. I did so openly clearly stating that it is MY opinion.

And this is exactly why I do not care about people like you who clearly confirm the ‘my way or the highway’ attitude.
If I do not share your opinion I’m 80 years old or some lunatic amateur. Real classy response…

Sorry that you feel so betrayed by Apple and fair enough that it makes you decide to use other software and hardware. But please do not call me things without knowing who I am or what I do and how many years experience I have using any NLE. I did not call you anything nor did I call anybody not using FCPx or not wanting to use it not a storyteller or anything else.
I used the term to express that I’m not a heavy FX user. Just a lot of straight forward editing. Maybe I should have said documentary editing if that makes you feel less annoyed. And some docu people can’t use FCPx because they need multi editor workflows as Mark pointed out.

But I said it is my story, not yours or anybodies else’s.

Now you have to excuse me because I need to upload another Youtube video before I join my mates at our retirement home annual wheelchair party 🙂

[Carsten Orlt]

[Dennis Radeke] “You don’t HAVE to convert your footage ever”

Thank you for the clarification Dennis. I do not know Premiere in detail so I was misinformed.

Could you explain how it does work when you put 5 different codecs into one sequence? Will the final output switch on the fly between the different codecs or does it convert everything on the fly to a chosen master codec? I always thought you need a final render in the end at least?

Cheers
Carsten

[Carsten Orlt]

What I don’t understand is why you are so angry that you have to throw around insults after insult just because I stated my personal opinion. I did so openly clearly stating that it is MY opinion.

And this is exactly why I do not care about people like you who clearly confirm the ‘my way or the highway’ attitude.
If I do not share your opinion I’m 80 years old or some lunatic amateur. Real classy response…

Sorry that you feel so betrayed by Apple and fair enough that it makes you decide to use other software and hardware. But please do not call me things without knowing who I am or what I do and how many years experience I have using any NLE. I did not call you anything nor did I call anybody not using FCPx or not wanting to use it not a storyteller or anything else.
I used the term to express that I’m not a heavy FX user. Just a lot of straight forward editing. Maybe I should have said documentary editing if that makes you feel less annoyed. And some docu people can’t use FCPx because they need multi editor workflows as Mark pointed out.

But I said it is my story, not yours or anybodies else’s.

Now you have to excuse me because I need to upload another Youtube video before I join my mates at our retirement home annual wheelchair party 🙂

[Carsten Orlt]

It’s the show your working on.

[Carsten Orlt]

[Mark Raudonis] “In my world (The Real World)”

What do you mean by ‘The Real World Mark?

Cheers
Carsten

[Carsten Orlt]

[Tim Wilson] “I can see FCPX maybe entering into a conversation because it rattles the 100 year old conventions of film editing that FCP Legacy was built on. “

Could you explain what you mean by this? Many thanks!

[Tim Wilson] “But when I see people call THAT revolutionary, their credibility drops to zero and I go back to picking my nose.”

you missed a couple of words in the sentence: … revolutionary, FOR ME their credibility …

Cheers
Carsten

[Carsten Orlt]

Tom was only trying to point out that we have been here before.

Jim I don’t know with what version of Final Cut legacy you started using it, but I started with version 1 and I remember corrupted sequences or project and lots of problems.

We as a community are eternally grateful that you post your experiences because it tells the rest of us where the pitfalls are and how to possible avoid a similar disaster you went through. It is also understandable that you are still p***** of and say things like horrible code etc. Fair enough.

I guess your experience underlines the fact why some people stay away from early software adoptions and wait until things settle down. Your trust into Apple improving FCPx is a personal choice. Some think they will, some take your experience as proof that they won’t.

FCPx is new and right now is going through the same early problem stages as every complex new software. Apple should have called FCPx something different than FCP legacy to avoid the perception that they build on the old code base and therefor stable performance of FCP7.

I hope you keep posting problems as they arise because for the rest of us your trouble was worth it. We are all smarter because of it. Somebody has to get burned first. Sorry it was you this time!!

Cheers
Carsten

[Carsten Orlt]

Unfortunately not. It also happens when you use the 2 window trim mode. Have tried everything. Just doesn’t stick.

One of the things they need to fix.