[Bill Kaminski]

I put my name in Google and this group of posts came up! Thanks for your comments, Steve. The client mentioned – actually specified is more like it, that he wanted this video posted on internet movie sites. I really want any client to have a “happy” memory of anything I do for them – right now the client has that & I don’t want that to change.

After my initial posts the client told me he also planned to submit the video for possible major television network airplay. Doing it “crappy” won’t cut it. So do I want a satisfied client or loyal client? I think if I do the client’s new project, I won’t have either one.

[Bill Kaminski]

You’re right; I can’t decide. I have a standard I want to maintain; I also have this gut feeling the client’s hoping I just won’t be able to do “hold myself back” from doing anything less than higher level, more creative work – for the price of something less complex. The other problem I have is the client’s previous project had a definite purpose, and the video meant something to a LOT of people. I believe anyone describing a Lexus is NOT going to be satisfied with a Yugo.

I’ll quote a price based on something I can live with regarding quality; with anything extra done at my hourly rate. I already recommended the client shop around for pricing to see what someone else will do & what they’d charge. That’s when he requested a quote based on “simple.”

For lip synching, sounds like you’re thinking of something like Daz’s Mimic. The client isn’t requesting characters or cartoons in his script.

[Bill Kaminski]

Thanks for your input; I liked the wording. I did state to the sales & marketing VP I wanted to retain rights to utilize the production for demo purposes when we spoke last week. I submitted a revised proposal based on a lot of the advice in this thread. If the company decides to go for it, I will have an attorney draft the agreement.

[Bill Kaminski]

Thanks Mark, for a very detailed response and LOTS of good advice. My gut feeling after the first meeting with the sales & marketing vice president was they may have chosen not to quote “a budget” in order to get a low-ball price, and seal that “number” in a contract; which is why I included “a change in the scope of the production will change the estimated costs”. You never know, so putting time into a proposal would most likely reveal more details re: motives and personalities.

I HAVE heard that before, “…we have lots more work and want to use you….yada, yada, yada…”. I know those deals usually go nowhere and I ask them, “If you have that much work, why don’t you try and save money and do it yourself? Get a mini DV cam and an iMac.” Those people usually go silent.

I’ll submit a revised proposal, based on the “change in scope of the production we discussed”. When someone tells me what they want; it always turns out that really is what they are going to push for, whether they intend to pay for it or not. When the company’s graphic artist called me he said the sales & marketing VP goes nuts over anything 3D, so I brought samples of 3D work & AE animations included in my demos to our first meeting. That may be a factor in deciding if this company chooses me to do the work; – then I get a deposit and they pay their bills along the way.

I like what Steve Wargo has posted on his website about pricing: “You get what you pay for and you don’t get what you don’t pay for” & comments posted about “charity work”; i.e., greedy people just don’t do it.

[Bill Kaminski]

Thanks for your replies; great advice, and I intend to utilize it. Steve – thanks for the link, it was very educational. Before I get involved in creating a contract, I want to revise the cost estimate based on what the sales manager said he wanted in the video during our second meeting (i.e., before he cut back hours to “match” the dollar amount in the proposal), and see his response. I have a gut feeling he will be asking for whatever he mentioned during our second talk – and a whole lot more. I did include the sentence: “A change in scope in the production will change the estimated costs”, as the opening line in my proposal’s “cost estimate” section. What the sales manager REALLY wants involves more work for 2 months longer than originally presented.

Bill_K

[Bill Kaminski]

Things worked out. I had to leave a LOT of messages on Monday – my inquiry of when will the vice president be in was answered: “he is out for the next 3 days”. I explained the situation and was informed, “we will try to get in touch with him for you”. I got a call back & wound up revising the contract for the more involved edit with more images which was my first proposal. A company courier delivered a check for the difference in deposit amount & signed (revised) agreement.

Thanks to all who responded to this thread.

Bill K

[Bill Kaminski]

Thanks to all for your input & suggestions. It will be interesting to see how things turn out – the client needs the edit on DVD to show at a company anniversary dinner in exactly two weeks. They do highway construction & build bridges – perhaps today will be a test of building “bridges” in relationships. If things work out & I do the work, maybe the vice president will give me a hard hat to wear while I edit!

Bill K

[Bill Kaminski]

The first e-mail I got from the company’s vice president after receiving the deposit check (got the signed contract the day before and reminded them I needed a deposit to start work – per the contract) read: “…I estimate we will be providing you about 190 pictures to include. This is more than what we originally thought

[Bill Kaminski]

Thanks to all for your replies. I have been communicating with one individual in negotiating; the local branch manager/senior vice president. I will take my time and re-read all these replies thoroughly before responding.

Bill K

[Bill Kaminski]

Nick, you are correct, we are both avoiding the money issue. Thanks for the insight where this company is coming from – i.e., this project is probably not a budget line item. I did show them how I could edit out image blemishes in their photos during the meeting – the vice president’s reaction was immediate: “what did you do” – (healing brush & cloning tools). He seemed amazed at the multiple steps in creating any sort of animation – rendering out a sequence in Lightwave, or creating a movie render in AE, then moving those items into Final Cut or Premiere Pro.

Thanks Nick & Ron, for your advice/input. I’ll let you know how things turn out.

Bill K