Whats a good reason to keep Bpav folders after exporting to MXF?

[Craig Seeman]

[Frank Manno] “Why would I ever need/want it since I have the MXF files?
“

Because not all NLEs and programs can use MXF.
The MP4 can be rewrapped to MXF, MOV or use as is depending on the program. Hand that MXF to a client or other post production facility that can’t handle that file and they will curse you. Don’t make someone else’s work harder or they actually may have the right to bill you for the hardship.

The BPAV are your camera masters and that’s the beginning and end of it.

I’ve never heard anyone in this business say “Why would I ever need the camera masters (certain news outlets as the exception)?” so I really can’t fathom why anyone would think different about the BPAV.

[Michael Palmer]

Card Stuff?, I think of it as media management, and from here out you will need to keep a close eye on these files that most likely will live on a hard drive (or two to protect yourself).

We have seen many people with issues with converted media. It is a good idea to archive the original files as you may need to work on a different platform later at the clients request. If these files came off a tape and captured to MXF I’m sure you wouldn’t trash the tape after capture. With the price dropping on SDHC media cards you may consider this as your tape. Search MxR/SDHC, this is a good solution.

Good Luck
Michael Palmer

[Clint Fleckenstein]

It really is a mindset issue. Think of that BPAV folder as a tape, pure and simple. The benefit of this “tape” is that you don’t have to have a certain model/format of “deck” to play it back or “dub” it to a format needed for delivery. Instead of renting a Digitbeta deck to play back the footage you shot or transfer to DVCPRO HD, for instance, you just load the XDCAM Transfer app and rewrap your BPAV folder’s files to what you, your editor, or your client require.

There was a long thread a while back from a guy who was given files made from someone’s BPAV folder in a format he couldn’t use (I forget which it was, MOV or MXF). If the person providing the raw footage trashed the raw camera files after exporting, they’re in trouble. If they archived them properly, they can simply export the clips in the format required for edit.

Suppose a magical third flavor besides MOV or MXF comes out someday, one that becomes the preferred edit standard…Sony needs only to update its XDCAM Transfer app, and EX users with properly archived BPAV folders will be able to use it to rewrap their camera raw files to that format as well. I’m probably oversimplifying, but I want to illustrate that keeping the raw camera files is the best way to prepare for unexpected developments.

Another loose comparison might be made to still cameras. Do you throw away your digital camera’s RAW files after converting to TIFF or JPEG? Heck, no. In that case, of course, there’s an additional image processing factor to consider, but the general idea is the flexibility you get from keeping the files generated by the camera.

It’s easy to fall into the trap of throwing one’s tape-based habits in the trash bin once those shiny new cards show up, but I think that proper archiving and housekeeping habits can translate across the board, whether shooting film, card, or tape.

Cf

[Don Greening]

[Frank Manno] “Why would I ever need/want it since I have the MXF files? “

When you were shooting tape did you toss them in the garbage after capturing what you needed to your computer or did you throw them in a box to collect dust?

Your answer will tell you what to do about the BPAV folders after you’re done importing what you want from them, because these folders are the new video tape.

– Don

[Noah Kadner]

Or would you shoot film and then toss away the negatives after you got prints? Keep the BPAV- surely a few extra hard drives is nothing next to the costs of god forbid reshooting something from scratch.

Noah

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[Michael Slowe]

Whilst quite a few of you experts have put the poster right about trashing camera original media files my questions centre on how to store the finished production. I confess that I never kept original tapes after a project was edited and mastered (to tape) but I guarded my tape masters like gold dust. It was Craig I think who said tape was finished and of course in the long run he is right. That being so what do we master to? Drives can’t be as safe as tape surely. DVD’s currently MPEG2, can’t compare with tape for quality and we don’t yet know their longevity. Blu-Ray seems to me the answer as far as quality goes but although Toast version 9 can burn them what spftware encodes them?

Michael Slowe

[Craig Seeman]

[Michael Slowe] “DVD’s currently MPEG2, can’t compare with tape for quality”

DVD is a medium. MPEG2 is a codec. You can store any file you’d like on a DVD. If your master is under 4.3GB in its native codec that’s fine. 7.95GB can go to DVD-DL. Blu-ray if around 23GB or 50GB (actual size a bit smaller). Once Sony provides the firmware update to their XDCAM Disc system you’ll be able to use that for file storage to their full capacity and those will have a very long lifespan.

[Michael Slowe] “Blu-Ray seems to me the answer as far as quality goes but although Toast version 9 can burn them what spftware encodes them?
“

You do NOT want to encode. Use the discs to store the master file.
We have a plethora of backup means today. At some point all media “ages” and one will have to move the file to a new media format. NEVER ENCODE. NEVER DEGRADE YOUR MASTER. NEVER EVER.

[Michael Slowe]

Craig, I rather muddled my message but what I was trying to learn was what to actually exhibit (distribute) a film on in addition to archiving. If, as you state, tape is going I was complaining that SD DVD’s are a poor second in quality. Blu-Ray must eventually be the answer if only we could encode them. I appreciate that files can be stored on Blu-Ray but you can’t feed files into a projector or even HD TV can you?

Michael Slowe

[Don Greening]

[Michael Slowe] “I appreciate that files can be stored on Blu-Ray but you can’t feed files into a projector or even HD TV can you?”

No you can’t, and if you were able to then you would have done your archiving improperly. What we’re all suggesting is a backup of your native EX files to alternate mediums such as Blu-ray or XDCAM disc. With programs like Toast® 10 it’s never been easier to backup to Blu-ray media. When you consider that dual layer BD-R discs will hold an advertised 50 Gbytes of data it makes sense to at least give it some thought.

As has been pointed out already, backing up data, and in this case EX video files, you simply copy the files to your backup medium. It’s just a drag and drop thing. There is no encoding to another format such as an MPEG2 or H.264 video stream that you can view with a Blu-ray player. To do so defeats the whole purpose of backing up original format files.

– Don

[Michael Slowe]

Yes but Don, as I explained to Craig, I am primarily concerned as to how our finished projects are actually exhibited (shown). We go to a great deal of trouble and expense to get super picture quality and then it’s destroyed by the MPEG2 compression, unless it goes out through the latest upscaling players and super projectors. It’s all very well archiving the original media and even our master edits but what about the audience view? That’s where I’m hoping Blu-Ray comes to the rescue.

Michael Slowe