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Wait for the new MacPro or get the new iMac?
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[Craig Seeman] “Which is why I said I expect to see 16x PCIe. That will handle 8x and 16x cards. I do not expect to see 4x slots though. My guess would be it’ll have two 16x slots.”
Here’s the thing I don’t understand about that assumption. The market for dual Xeon workstations is admittedly small. For many in that market 2 16x PCIe slots with everything else 4x is just not enough. It’s not enough for me, I’m pretty sure it’s not enough for Walter, I think it won’t be enough for many in the EFX / Compositing field who make up a sizable chunk of this very small market. Why would Apple want to come out with a workstation that automatically writes off lets say 20% (wild guess) of the already small workstation market. Unless this machine is being designed specifically for the server market, a market Apple has pretty much abandoned, where’s the advantage of small size if it costs you any power user that needs 3 or more PCIe slots. HP and Dell are competing heavily in the workstation market and I don’t see them limiting PCIe slots, I see them adding as many as they can — that’s the point of a workstation isn’t it? I just don’t see the market that Apple would be going for with your proposed Dual Xeon, 2 slot + thunderbolt mini station.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
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nothin’ attached to nothin’
“Deciding the spine is the process of editing” F. Bieberkopf -
[Jeremy Garchow] “Meaning, you are dedicating one particular volume for testing or only one volume in particular does not show the latency for whatever reason?”
We have one volume actually in production that does lots of ingest that uses the minis with san links and gigabit thunderbolt adaptors as metadata controllers. They use the built in gigabit nic for the private md net and the thunderbolt gigabit adaptor through the second port on the san link as the “public” lan connection. No complaints yet. It’s snappy.
[Jeremy Garchow] “Have you tried an ATTO box?”
No but it would in affect be the same situation as the promise san link in that it is a container for a pci-e fiberchannel card with a thunderbolt adaptor on it. I would assume similar latency.
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[Marcus Moore] “Exactly- this is why I don’t agree with this theory from Craig.”
Craig’s theory does fit well in to the Apple ecosystem though, you can’t deny that.
[Marcus Moore] “PCIe is I’m sure a technology that Apple would love to be done with, but there’s no viable alternative today.”
PCIe as a technology, no, but being done with PCIe as a design aesthetic, yes.
Thunderbolt, by definition, includes PCIe.
Jeremy
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Agreed.
The assumption of a mini-tower has always seemed dubious to me. There’s little to no market segment between those already being served by an iMac, and those who need the power (relatively speaking) and expandability of a MacPro.
And I think we can all agree that once this new product is released, the MacPro as it exists today will go away- there’s no room for a 2-tier solution in the Big Iron space.
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Right, but not at the speeds most many PCIe cards require.
I’ve said before that if TB was available at the needed speeds, I think a modular product would probably be what we were getting.
But if we take Apple as true to it’s word that it will release a “really great” product for people who use MacPros, AND take for granted that Thunderbolt isn’t going to change substantially this year- then we’re sort of painted into a corner, aren’t we?
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[Jeremy Garchow] “A different theory is Phi, but that’s a whole ‘nother set of pipe dream.”
I’d be interested in hearing a pipe dream theory or two regarding Phi, if you care to share.
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Herb, I’m basing my reasoning from what I see of Apple’s business model.
If Apple’s assessment was similar to yours then in 2012 they would have released a new MacPro with new Xeons… although that might still not fit your description because the MacPro only has one open 16x PCIe slot. I’m not saying there’s no need for multiple 16x slots but I don’t see Apple heading in that direction because it’s a small market.
[Herb Sevush] “Unless this machine is being designed specifically for the server market, a market Apple has pretty much abandoned”
I actually think this is more likely in building a machine that can “serve” more markets. The box would range from a Xeon equivalent of the MacMini to a workstation that someone using Resolve might be OK with (2 16x GPU slots).
[Herb Sevush] “HP and Dell are competing heavily in the workstation market and I don’t see them limiting PCIe slots,” I’m not absolutely sure of the value of these markets to either given that HP was considering leaving the PC market (obviously changed course though) and Dell may be sold to a Private Equity firm (and such articles note that Dell themselves have been making acquisitions geared towards business service, rather than PC sales as a business model).
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[Marcus Moore] “But if we take Apple as true to it’s word that it will release a “really great” product for people who use MacPros, AND take for granted that Thunderbolt isn’t going to change substantially this year- then we’re sort of painted into a corner, aren’t we?”
Certainly, unless they know something that we don’t, you know, that whole “double down on secrecy” thing. That previous sentence is a hyperlink that probably doesn’t show up in your email, but does show up on the cow.
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[David Eaks] “I’d be interested in hearing a pipe dream theory or two regarding Phi, if you care to share.”
First here:
https://forums.creativecow.net/readpost/335/44185
We get into it a bit here:
https://forums.creativecow.net/readpost/335/46052
Jeremy
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[Craig Seeman] ” I’m not absolutely sure of the value of these markets to either given that HP was considering leaving the PC market (obviously changed course though) and Dell may be sold to a Private Equity firm (and such articles note that Dell themselves have been making acquisitions geared towards business service, rather than PC sales as a business model).”
Come on Craig, this is a distortion and you know it. HP was considering getting out of the consumer PC market, it never once, not for a moment considered getting out of the workstation market. And Dell is acting real funny for someone not committed to the workstation market – the T7600 would blow anything your describing out of the water.
Herb Sevush
Zebra Productions
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nothin’ attached to nothin’
“Deciding the spine is the process of editing” F. Bieberkopf
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