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Trying new stuff
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[Steve Connor] “I am very much enjoying the irony in his thread”
Yeah, well. You, know–Karma.
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I do wonder who was “snark” in his comments. How do you know anything about my experience in the first place? I added a few lines of my experience to the discussion, given in a thread I don’t quite understand what it has to do in the FCPX-board, but never the less, I contributed something to the discussion. You… well yeah…
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[Erik Lindahl] “I do wonder who was “snark” in his comments. “
I’m not sure what you mean by this. I was referring to your sarcastic post. Perhaps you are unfamiliar with the term “snark.”
[Erik Lindahl] “How do you know anything about my experience in the first place? “
When I read your original post, I wondered if there was some serious problem with Premiere that I was missing. I did a search on “Premiere” and “corrupt” to see what kind of recent issues might have arisen. I saw your name, and read through the thread where you were presenting/debating your recent problems.
If you do a similar search with any other NLE, you’ll find similar issues with similar numbers. I am in no way discounting the inconvenience you experienced, and am sympathetic to anger you feel. However, I think you were greatly over expressing the problem in a, well, snarky sort of way. The reason many people aren’t talking about it is that it isn’t happening to many people. True, Walter B. does mention it in his article, but also mentions easy workarounds, and that he feels Adobe is working hard to find out what the issue is.
[Erik Lindahl] “I added a few lines of my experience to the discussion, given in a thread I don’t quite understand what it has to do in the FCPX-board, but never the less, I contributed something to the discussion. You… well yeah…”
This is not an FCP X board. If you more carefully read the title, you’ll see that it is a forum that was set up to debate whether or not FCP X is the best choice for any given editor. Some of us would prefer that the title change to something a little more neutral, and a little less demeaning of FCP X, but the powers that be have thus far shown no inclination to do so.
As far as adding to the discussion, well–we’ll have to disagree about that.
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To actually add something to the discussion:
Exporting of timelines in PrPro is quite bad compared to FCP (even FCPX from the little experience I have of it). The human interaction before you can actually achieve a batch-export is far from optimal. This could be part of the “more clicks than I’m used to” phenomenon. Why on earth Adobe hasn’t just implemented an AE-like export in PrPro is beyond me.
People can show rendering X frames in app A vs B vs C is Y% faster but sometimes dumb planning of an app actually makes the rendering part, for some work flows, not count that much. We output a lot of shortform broadcast masters and here FCP7 shines.
On the flip side PrPro shines in the fact it can actually play back the MPEG2 streams we send to the broadcaster. One just has to turn off the meta-data writing the CS-package does to files or they are seen as broken by the transport system we use.
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[Erik Lindahl] “Exporting of timelines in PrPro is quite bad compared to FCP (even FCPX from the little experience I have of it). “
I can relate to that. I work in short form, and in easy formats like ProResHQ, so its not a hardship for me. But I hear it is quite troublesome for long form, especially with a deadline. I don’t get the extra clicks you are talking about, but that may be because I work with CODECs that are particularly easy for Premiere, and once I set up a timeline template, I can use it over and over, both for preview and for export.
[Erik Lindahl] “People can show rendering X frames in app A vs B vs C is Y% faster but sometimes dumb planning of an app actually makes the rendering part, for some work flows, not count that much. We output a lot of shortform broadcast masters and here FCP7 shines.
“I agree with this completely. I don’t know if it is because it is what I’m most used to or not, but I still make most of my broadcast master variants in FCP7. I find it extremely fast and stable. Currently, I’m enjoying cutting spots on Avid, but I like to go back to FCP to do all of the title variations–Next, Tuesday, Tonight, Tomorrow, etc. Its possible that X might be good for this too, but I haven’t tried it yet.
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We’ve in the same boat here. We do all our masters for broadcast in FCP7 still.
In PrPro you have to export each sequence manually per sequence. You can add them to a batch-list in AME but that oddly takes a lot of time per sequence one is sending out. In FCPX there is a similar issues, but the background-processing seems far most “instant” (and from my experience exporting broadcast stuff FCPX is much faster than PrPro or FCP7). A “backwards solution” is to add sequences to AME via AME but this again is quite slow compared to Batch Export in FCP7 or what Adobe already has in AE.
So the above involves more clicks and more human interaction waiting time which in our case is often worse than rendering times (as these even in FCP7 are relatively fast). And on my machine and the formats we work with (Uncompressed or ProRess QuickTime), the actual export in FCP7 is as fast as PrPro. As mentioned FCPX is far faster but FCPX has some quality issues in working with SD which makes it a less optimal choice here.
Again, on the flip side, I love the fact that PrPro allows me to edit image sequences and playback, for example, MPEG2 streams out to the broadcast monitor. I don’t however feel very “safe” in the application yet given our issues with either corrupt projects and / or the fact the program will accept corrupt media. Given the “all native” approach this potentially is a problem when dealing with less than optimal H264-files from unknown sources. Some kind of bullet proof validation-process would be appreciated here.
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Sounds like you’re in love. So there’s no need for you to be hanging out here anymore. Go sell crazy someplace else.
Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California -
I was trying to be nice saying I didn’t understand it fully. I was an Adobe beta tester from 1.5 through CS3 and it was one of the most frustrating experiences I’ve ever had. I’m a 20 year Photoshop and Illustrator pro and have used After Effects and Premiere since 1998. I’m one of the most open minded Editors you’ll ever meet and have used just about every NLE out there from Edius to Vegas to Avid (including myriad of versions of Media Composer and DS), FCP since version 1 and Premiere for payed work that ranges from low budget docs to $60 million Hollywood features. I’ve been editing since 1986 when I started cutting 16mm via flatbed and I’ve been a forum leader here on the Cow for 11 years and though I’m an opinionated bastard I can back it up with decades of pretty decent work.
There isn’t a single thing, not one. that Premiere does as well or better than FCPX 10.07. It’s garbage as far as I’m concerned and I’ll never use it again – to attempt to “master it” would be a colossal waste of time. I will continue to use the rest of the Adobe Suite via the Cloud subscription and highly recommend it to others.
As far as your jazz analogy – I’ve played guitar since I was 10 and love all forms of music – not just jazz – so shut your Phrygian pie hole you elitist prick.
Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California -
Hilarious – you just proved my point – the idiotic way you have to noodle around to find sync. I stand by my statement – it’s garbage and has no business being in the same suite as Photoshop and After effects.
Why should anyone have to “dig deep” to find things that are plane as day in Vegas, FCP7 or Avid.? And yes I do miss sync indicators in FCPX and hope they’re added soon. I also assume Premiere will have them soon as it’s hard to call a NLE “pro” without pro features. Sync indicators aside, the list of missing and poorly thought features in Premiere is endless and not worth any more of my time – years of being a beta tester proved to me how inept the Premiere team is – I had hoped 6 would be better but it’s not even close…
Lance Bachelder
Writer, Editor, Director
Irvine, California -
what’s crazy? getting drunk on merlot, and then pretending to have enough competence in PPro that you can say its clunky?
just so you can say that FCPX solves everything? Which is all you wanted to say in the first place?
https://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics
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