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Throwing out the Kool Aid
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[David Roth Weiss] “It doesn’t take a magician.”
What I am saying is, no matter how much experience you have it doesn’t mean you sit down to a system and it magically runs flawlessly all the time because it knows you have 20 years under your belt. Experience doesn’t make you a magician. Certain systems have quirks and oddities.
I have to agree with everyone else here, solid drive system, solid FCP system.
Jeremy
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[JeremyG] “What I am saying is, no matter how much experience you have it doesn’t mean you sit down to a system and it magically runs flawlessly all the time because it knows you have 20 years under your belt. Experience doesn’t make you a magician. Certain systems have quirks and oddities.”
Amen to that. We always have some sort of quirks and issues on our systems, but with all the experience I have, I can usually figure out a workaround very quickly and then go back later and figure out how to fix whatever the quirk was.
My mantra is always “workaround the issue now, figure it out later.”
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
https://www.biscardicreative.com
HD Editorial & Animation for Broadcast and independent productions.All Things Apple Podcast! https://cowcast.creativecow.net/all_things_apple/index.html
Read my blog! https://blogs.creativecow.net/WalterBiscardi
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Walter- Curious to know if you guys have tested any of the G-Tech G-Speed arrays…
Christian Glawe editor/compositor christianglawe.com Read my blog: https://blogs.creativecow.net/blog/111 Pain is temporary… film is forever.
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Walter, Bob and all,
Thank you for your patience. Very tired on this end. Got the thing out to tape though we had terrible sync issues cross-converting. I went ahead and purchased a Gen 10 and it helped but the HDCam was sure touchy. Out to D5 was never an issue.
Walter, thanks for the offer. And to Bob, Dulce Duo Quad and a unit I built that has become my favorite. Here is the rack:
https://www.pc-pitstop.com/sata_enclosures/scsata12RMd.asp
and I use the HighPoint 2340 with very expensive cables. I get at least 415 MB/sec through the thing and it runs very cool. Stuffed with 12 750s, one which was bad initally and had to be replaced. The card has internal mini-sas connectors and I have a backplane on the computer to adapt mini SAS to SAS which then connects to multi-lane on the chassis. Very smart software management.
I have had issues with the Cal Digits. I saw recommendations here in the forum and bought them based on that and sorry to hear about all the issues. They really didn’t play in this senario as they are filled with an older project, thank god.
I really wish there were an “attic” like Avid has so a project can be resurrected by copying bins directly. In this case, it would have saved days. We basically would boot up each project until we got one that would not crash, started a new project, copied bins and necessary sequences into it, closed the old project and re-build from an offline output for 4 days. This project started as a 5.1.4 and when the picture was locked, we upgraded to 6 to be able to color-grade with secondaries using Color, which is awesome but has some growing to do.
Sorry for the rant guys, I knew I was sticking my hand in a scorpion’s pit, but then again you’re the only people on all the boards who I truly respect and are consistent with your responses. Please understand that I’m an old Kem editor who jumped to CMX50 to Grass Valley to Axial to Avid in 1989, yes, 4th one delivered to LA and have been and Avid guy since. I’ve had my share of Avid issues but I guess I’ve been incredibly lucky with Avid as it has always been a workhorse for me. But once I offlined on FCP I was sold. Very smart interface and very powerful. Finishing on the thing is another matter for another day.
Many thanks to all,
Don Wilson
MississippiSon.com
AmericanaMediaInc.com
dwilson@americanamediainc.com -
Whoa, wait a minute! 🙂 We have had 4 Fusion 500 boxes from Sonnet and there is revolving door of sending them back for repair. I don’t know what’s going on there, but we literally sent one away to be fixed and had two waiting. So, since we didn’t have original boxes, we got one back and put the other one in the box and sent it back. We have another one waiting for the box to come back. This makes 3 within a few months.
The problems we’ve experienced (as noted on these boards):
-The drives all check out fine, media checks out fine, but we have had sudden unmounting of drives. Editing along, suddenly a click and bye-bye drives.
-Another Fusion Box had a faulty fan. The thing burned extremely hot one day before I noticed it…thanks, Sonnet. I’m still having problems with those drives now. I think they were damaged.I switched to leasing a 14 x 750 XRaid and just started using MetaSAN. I’m hoping I won’t have as many gripes about this setup.
Glad Sonnet is working for you, Walter! It did for us for a while…but the new units did NOT.
Kevin
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[Don Wilson] “Walter, thanks for the offer. And to Bob, Dulce Duo Quad and a unit I built that has become my favorite. Here is the rack:
https://www.pc-pitstop.com/sata_enclosures/scsata12RMd.asp
and I use the HighPoint 2340 with very expensive cables. I get at least 415 MB/sec through the thing and it runs very cool. Stuffed with 12 750s, one which was bad initally and had to be replaced. The card has internal mini-sas connectors and I have a backplane on the computer to adapt mini SAS to SAS which then connects to multi-lane on the chassis. Very smart software management.”
Does it come in RAID protection at all or just JBOD? That’s the only thing that would keep me from using it. These RAID 5 systems are really impressing me.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
https://www.biscardicreative.com
HD Editorial & Animation for Broadcast and independent productions.All Things Apple Podcast! https://cowcast.creativecow.net/all_things_apple/index.html
Read my blog! https://blogs.creativecow.net/WalterBiscardi
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dont’ worry – the XServe RAID will give you plenty of problems.
Walter tested out the new SAS RAID 5 product, not the 500P port multiplier that you refer to.I feel everyone’s pain here. You guys are editing all day, but the only time I hear from anyone is when there is trouble, so I see drive issues from EVERY manufacturer every day. I know that you have had issues with the Sonnet 500P, and Walter has had issues with the Cal Digit. If I observed isolated incidents that I have seen, I would have the same prejudice, but because I install so many systems, I can honestly tell you that the conventional products from Cal Digit and Sonnet have been teriffic. This is not to say that I have not seen issues with isolated incidents (as I described in previous posts in this thread). But it is rare, and these instances have been due to data corruption – NOT DEFECTIVE PRODUCTS FROM CAL DIGIT OR SONNET.
I have the Dulce Systems Duo Quad here right now (the RAID 5 SATA product), and it is absolutely amazing. Maxx Digital is selling it right now. But it does cost more than a bare bones SATA array.
It’s easy to say “this sucks and that sucks”, but the corruption that started this thread, that Don is having is still a mystery to me.
Bob Zelin
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Walter,
Jbod through Raid 5. Raid is controlled by the raid controller, the High Point 2340. Here is some info in it:
Best,
Don Wilson
AMericanaMediaInc.com
MississippiSon.com
dwilson@americanamediainc.com -
Don, I think that you and I and David Weiss should have lunch sometime. We are all in the Valley…I am in North Hollywood and David is a BIT farther north in Woodland Hills, right David?
Sit down, chat…complain about Avid and complain about FCP. Praise both. Whathaveyou.
Most of the issues that happen with FCP…or even Avid…are pilot error. People not used to the system and things getting messed up and put in odd places or something. Havind been an Avid Assist for 5 years, I learned all the tricks needed to ensure that the Avid was running smooth. Such as tossing the database files occasionally. Looking for the CREATING files when you had a crash. Lots of stuff. And if you didn’t treat an Avid just right, it’d start flaking on you. Same with FCP…you have to learn how to maintain it as well. It is a slow process, but I get it.
A lot of stuff happens when you have editors used to one system jumping onto another and trying to work like they did on the first system. Sorry, but ain’t gonna work. I am now BACK on an Avid (Meridian v11, OS 9, Unity) and it took me a WEEK to relearn the darn thing. Grumbling because I can’t drag my clips about and re-arrange things….but, HEY, this dynamic trimming is great. Different approaches. But I have seen more issues with people coming from other editing systems than people who have ONLY edited with FCP. It takes a while getting used to things.
And I know that a lot of stuff is pilot error because of what Bob said…one array fails for one guy, but works fine for another. SAME PHYSICAL ARRAY. That points to pilot error. I had that with a company here where I helped them set up their shop and got things running. They brought in a bunch of editors…used to Avid…and the show started falling apart. Other people brought in to fix things, other editors came in…and things started working. No hardware was swapped.
As for drive RAIDS…there is just way too much choice out there. That is both good and bad. Avids worked ONLY with their drives, which they tested beyond belief before they implimented. And even then there were still occasional issues. But you HAD to buy from them, and at ASTRONOMICAL prices. With FCP there are dozens of RAID manufacturers out there, lots of people to choose from. One company works for some guys, but not others. Some have good products and buggy products. Some swear by LaCie because they never had an issue, and others have nothing BUT issues. Walter had huge issues with Caldigit…yet I haven’t had one (one minor hiccup that worked itself out, no loss of data). And we both work on the same type of projects…DVCPRO HD, AJA hardware, G5s. So go figure.
If FCP was crashing all the time and unworkable and causing long hours for everyone like it was for you…the platform would be dropped like THAT. I wouldn’t stand for it….so I can see where you are coming from. But it isn’t failing for a lot of us, so it is still going strong. I hope you figure out what is happening..and I hope you get to test a lot of drive arrays to see what works for you.
And…let’s do lunch.
Or drinks…actually. I am in Hollywood during the day on this old, but rather stable Avid system.
Shane
Littlefrog Post
http://www.lfhd.net -
[Bob Zelin] “the corruption that started this thread, that Don is having is still a mystery to me.”
Bob,
I suspect that Don’s problems are possibly related to one of the following two quips from the Kona FAQ.
Q: Can I use eSata storage for HD?
A: AJA has yet to find and certify an eSata 8 drive JBOD solution for 10 Bit uncompressed HD that is reliable over time with the KONA cards. We continue to look for a capable solution.Q: Are there any important things to be aware of when setting up a RAID for Video capture?
A: Many SCSI and Fiber raids that use SATA or IDE with a backplane and controller often offer user settings for configurations. Be sure to format the Physical disk in a 512 Block size and never exceed a single volume size of 2TB. Multiple 2TB (or below) can be striped together by the OS for larger capacity storage.“No job is worth doing more than once…”
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Post-production Supervisor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles
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