The value of a proper editing reel

[Arnie Schlissel]

You know, in the age of the internet & desktop DVD authoring, there’s no excuse not to have a decent reel. Unless of course, you have no talent. Or you’re an idiot who doesn’t understand what a reel should & can be.

My reel generally conforms to your idea. There’s a movie on my website with the same splash reel that starts my DVD. It’s cut to music & has titles to highlight what I do. On the DVD, it takes you to a menu that lets you look at a few short, whole pieces. You can explore them at your leisure, or throw the disk in the trash at your own discretion.

This is the beauty of DVD & websites, you can offer extra stuff to suppliment your reel, but I still think you need the splash reel to kick it off.

Arnie
Now in post: Peristroika, a film by Slava Tsukerman
https://www.arniepix.com/blog

[Rocco Rocco]

I used to think that you needed one resume and one showreel and you sent them out each time. I’ve since realized that in fact you need a reel and a resume PER job you apply for. Each one tailored to the company or person you’re applying to.

I also prefer to go into meetings with a DVD of clips to chat about rather than a montage to show in silence.

And what are “E2s”?

[Nicole Haddock]

I agree 100% about tailoring resumes. I get 2 page resumes from recent graduates. That drives me crazy. I also get 2 page resumes from producer/editor/DP types who’s experience tends to drift one way, but yet they’re applying for a post position. Also drives me crazy. With a little delete this, expand on that, their resumes wouldn’t end up in the trash pile.

The only problem I see with clips is that you’re assuming you’re getting to the meeting stage. I tend to use reels, either via the web or dvd, to weed people out. But as long as they’re short clips, not 10 minutes from whatever type film, then I’m all for it.

An E2 is another name for Assistant Editor, at least on the east coast area 🙂

[Grinner Hester]

Nicole, there is not a more important career tool to an editor than a reel and reputation. Because you’ll usually be applying for gigs outside of your market, you have no reputation and therefore, your reel is literally a make or break for a job. It’ll depict how much you get paid more than your salary negotiation. It should be no longer than 5 minutes tops. If they wanna see more, awesome. Enjoy the gig.
It’s fine, and a good idea to have longer examples onliune should they wanna go through and see how you apply timing in a show but if you gamble with making somone bored with your demo reel, your resume is thrown in the trash and your DVD is used as a coaster.
As far as content, don’t hilight so much of what you have done… hilight what you want to do. That is to say, if you like making music vodeos, make a music video reel. Dig effects? We need to see em. Straight up story-teller? Tell some. While people stress you have less than 5 minutes to win them over, I’m here to tell you that you have about 10 seconds and that begins with the labeling of your reel and it’s menu. Judging begins when your package is opened so make every detail scream that you are their next ace in the hole.
When you interview… do just that. Interview them. Make sure this really is a place you want to bless with your presence more than half of your waking hours. If their are any things you don’t love about it on forst visit, brinbg em up right then. I use to interview in a tie-dyed t0shirt because I was always against trying to put dress codes on artists. This fixed that problem from the get go. If they dug it, we’d be cool. If they didn’t I would have been temporary anyway.
Talk to the other artists there. Do lunch or supper with em but get em away from the building so you can guage their happiness. They will level with you.

[Nicole Haddock]

“I’m here to tell you that you have about 10 seconds and that begins with the labeling of your reel and it’s menu”

Truer words were never spoken. It’s these seemingly little details that make people really stand out.

And I’ve done my fair share of interviewing in jeans and t-shirts. Always amusing and interesting to see their reactions, hah!

Thanks for your .02 grinner. Exactly the fodder I’m looking for!

[Andrew Kimery]

Assistant Editors needing reels depends on the job, IMO. I’ve interview at boutique places where they’ve wanted to see a reel because they were looking for some one who could wear more than one hat and I’ve interviewed for bigger post houses (or TV shows) where they don’t want to see a reel ’cause they are looking strictly handle the technical/nuts & bolts side of editing. Personally, if I was looking for an AE a reel wouldn’t interest me because there’s nothing in an reel that can show me if that person is a good AE or not.

If you are looking to “move up” in your area your personal connections mean more than your reel, IMO. Take post producers or more experienced editors in your market out to lunch/dinner/drinks (on you of course) for some quality face time. Don’t hit them up for work, but tell them about yourself, what you’ve done, what you want to do, etc.,. and ask for their advice and how they got to where they wanted to be in the industry. I’ve found that a lot of people really like helping out the young bloods and sharing their knowledge. After you’ve won them over w/your personality you can offer to send your resum

[Grinner Hester]

I know of no place that wants to hire good assistant editors. Every one of them are looking for potentially fine editors at an entry level rate. As a newby, if you apply as an assistant, you’ll be an intern. Apply as an editor and one can take the assistant’s gig offered.
This really doesnt end. Last time I was aksed “so where would you like to see yourself with this company?” I laughed and answered, “man, I’d like to own it.”

[Andrew Kimery]

[grinner hester] “I know of no place that wants to hire good assistant editors. Every one of them are looking for potentially fine editors at an entry level rate.”

Like I said, it depends on the job. I’ve worked at post houses that looked more “big picture” and I’ve worked on TV shows that don’t care where you want to be a year from now ’cause all they are looking for is an AE for the next 8 weeks. I’ve worked w/people that have been AEing on feature films for years and people that have gone from runner, to AE, to editor at trailer houses inside of 12 months. The rules change depending on where you play.

-Andrew

[Mark Raudonis]

All good advice and I agree with most of it.

I add one more thing to the “interview” process. I call it my “Technical proficiency exam”, but it’s really just one question. I say it’s worth double your starting salary if you nail it. So far, nobody has gotten it correct. Here it is: Explain to me the difference between drop frame and non drop frame time code.

In five seconds I know whether they’re BS’ing or not. A newbies answer to this question is just as revealing to me as looking at hours of their work… on line or via DVD. When viewing a sample reel there’s always the question of “who did what”. In an interview, very few people can bluff their way through.

Mark

[Boyd Mccollum]

[mark Raudonis] “Explain to me the difference between drop frame and non drop frame time code. “

would that be semi-colon vs. colon 🙂

Just to add a perspective to this thread from a different pov, I would ask what the hiring supervisors are doing to make things better? It’s all well and good to give advice on the importance of a reel, etc. and I think many editors applying for positions can do better. I’ve seen on a variety of forums, including here on the Cow, folks putting up reels, looking for feedback. (Not to mention the other advice I’ve heard from many folks that their reel never got them their jobs, but it was through their contacts. Heck, even one of the posters above recommended that approach – the “taking an editor out to dinner” type of thing.)

But each time the generic hiring supervisor receives something that doesn’t quite make the cut, or could have made the cut, do they give feedback to the editors that were applying? Like saying “hey, your reel pieces are too long” or “your music montage should have been only 60 seconds instead of 2 minutes” or “sending us to You Tube is unprofessional,” etc. The point I’m making is, some of the feedback needs to be given from the people hiring directly to the persons they are rejecting with specific reasons. Or else the person doesn’t have the opportunity to improve their reel in a practical sense.

It also doesn’t seem particularly hard to do that, just a simple “thank you for applying, your one piece reel bored us after 20 seconds and there were still 12 minutes to go and, oh btw, your You Tube screen name of Dips**t28 turned us off and scared our cat, so we threw it into the trash.”

I would also suggest that even if a person’s reel was one 12 minute piece, and the first minute kept you engaged, then it demonstrates that s/he can edit. If you can tell in 30 seconds or less that someone doesn’t have it, then you can tell in 30 seconds or less if they do. In fact, it would seem the length of the reel (too long or too short) is really irrelevant. And as someone who does long form editing, seeing a 2 minute music video or a graphics heavy piece doesn’t tell me anything about someone’s storytelling.

Hiring supervisors could also make it more clear as to what they are actually looking for in a reel – long form, quick cuts, spots, graphics, etc. Part of the problem I think is vagueness on the part of the people hiring to clarify what exactly they are looking for. For instance, if reels are important to you, and you know what you are looking for in a reel, state it. For instance, say the reel should have a 60 second or less music montage, followed by “x” number of spots that demonstrate the following “whatever your requirements are”. (for any decent, motivated editor, revising their reel, if necessary, to fit a specific request shouldn’t be that big a deal.)

OTOH, even though I’ve never seen Walter Murch’s reel, I’d hire him, even if he didn’t know the difference between drop frame and non drop frame timecode. That’s why I’d also hire Sean Cullen to be his E2 🙂

Happy New Year!

BTW, I think threads like this are necessary and helpful for editors, at least those who care, to make stronger and stronger applications each time out.