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The new Mac Book pro
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[Oliver Peters] “I think it’s too early to say that, so it’s good that Apple got in front of this quickly. Especially since – according to Apple – this affected ALL of those laptops, not just the i9.”
Yeah, but the tests on the i7s apparently didn’t see the same type of issues – which led a LOT of the people I converse with to immediately say that buying an i7 variant was the “smart play” – when in fact, it might not actually be.
The worse case, for me was following a thread on IIRC, MacRumors, – where a guy had received his brand spanking new i9 maxed out MacBook Pro – was horrified at the discussion. Decided to send it back bemoaning that after 3 years of waiting – he was CRUSHED at how flawed it was. Posted that his UPS guy had just picked up the package for return…
And the PATCH was released literally THAT hour.
A cringe worthy cautionary thread if I ever read one.
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
[Oliver Peters] “Huh? That’s hardly anyone’s motivation.”
Read the inter webs much?
????
I bet in 5 minutes I can find 100 folks posting that Premiere, AVID, FCP X or Resolve – as well as ALL the hardware from Apple, BlackMagic, DELL, HP, and Canon are entirely absolute overpriced CRAP and only a fool would use it/them/that.
Bitching about hardware and software is the CORE of the internet. And probably always will be.
Nothing new here at all.
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
[Bill Davis] “NO. That is NOT why throttling was occurring, as I understand it from my reading.
There wasn’t a “flaw in the processor” at all. It was an unsigned snippet of code in a Power Management Unit totally separate from the processor. “
Sorry, I typed that wrong. Not a processor flaw, but computer code designed to throttle it so it wouldn’t get too hot.
[Bill Davis] “As I understand it, the computer was NEVER overheating and running the fans to cool down an actually overheating issue. “
Correct, because if it went to a certain temp, the code would “throttle” the processor, making it not function as fast as it could, in order to keep the heat down. Notice that when the computer was put in the freezer, that the processor throttling was less. because it didn’t heat things up as much. so it was allowed to do more. But make no mistake, code was there to throttle it…intentionally.
Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def -
[Bill Davis] “But of course, this was NOT every user, and certainly not under EVERY load case, nor a problem making the overall computer unsuitable for most common tasks.”
Most common tasks aren’t ones that would require the i9 processor. That is for those who need the render power…video editors, 3D modeling, graphics. THEY are the ones springing for this processor, they are the ones who need this speed. I don’t see a writer, or student, or guy who writes computer code, game designer…shelling out extra bucks for the i9. They aren’t the ones who need that. The people who do, shell out the extra money specifically for it to render better than the i7…which it wasn’t. Not until the fix came about.
[Bill Davis] “That it was a problem affecting a very small class of users doesn’t make it right, of course.”
This “small class” of users is video professionals. You know…like the ones who use FCP-X. The ones you always say are a HUGE market for Apple. So first you tout them as this mass market..now you are saying they are a small class of users. Well, honestly, they are. Which is why Apple isn’t catering to them…not making the MacPro…sticking to computers that didn’t have tons of processing power because they make MORE money on the iphones. But now they are trying, only sorta. They are still trying to stick to their sleek designs that don’t cool things properly, because design is more important that function. They used to have a good balance between the two…but now they find the consumers more profitable so they go for the sleek…
Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def -
[Shane Ross] “This “small class” of users is video professionals. You know…like the ones who use FCP-X. The ones you always say are a HUGE market for Apple. “
That’s actually not true, at least as I understand it.
The extra grunt of the i9 doesn’t really help video raster work all that much. Where it shines, according to what I’ve read is in the 3D modeling and virtual reality areas where you’re processing massive arrays of polygons to create virtual worlds.
I’m sure it won’t HURT to do your day to day video rendering on it. And perhaps if you’re overlaying hugely complex graphics over video – you’ll want the extra power. But as I understand it – even facing an 8K raster, the performance gains of the i9 over the i7 might turn out to be kinda modest in the real world.
It seems to be one of those things like CPU vs GPU. The knee jerk idea is to simply max out each. But how that effects performance is going to be most effected by the type of work you do and the software you use most often.
My suspicion is that most mobile editors – we may not see much difference in performance at all.
Some DITs might. Other might not. It depends on the type of footage that particular laptop faces most often.
The folk who want to build and test games whilst working on the patio or the beach – yeah, THEY will totally want to rock the fastest i9 and the gruntiest machine they can get their paws on.
But most others, not so much.
If you just CUT on your laptop – but then move your work back to the office to render it out or master things – this whole i9 thing may be a serious non-issue.
Time will tell.
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
[Shane Ross] “Notice that when the computer was put in the freezer, that the processor throttling was less. because it didn’t heat things up as much. so it was allowed to do more. But make no mistake, code was there to throttle it…intentionally.”
Regardless, here we are a bit later – and the issue is identified and apparently corrected.
And all the stuff posted like THIS exchange I grabbed from the web and which should remain without attribution since the OP surely is regretting a bit jumping to this much of a conclusion…
“In my opinion, Apple seriously screwed up here. The testing that I did was easily within Apple’s capabilities, and it is highly irresponsible of them to ship these machines out this way. …”
THATS the type of Ready- Fire – Aim, stuff I’ve been talking about.
Opinions blurted out everywhere – with little foundation – nd it’s harder and harder to tell the ones based on actual FACT, from the ones that SOUND rational – but turn out to be largely blather when the dust settles.
By the way, that was posted under a “handle” as are most web musings these days.
It would go a LONG way to settle things down if folks would just post under their own names( like here on the Cow!) so that everyone needs to be responsible for what they get right, neutral or wrong, over time.
Might server to settle things down. Or Not! ????
Creator of XinTwo – https://www.xintwo.com
The shortest path to FCP X mastery. -
An interesting and as usual polarising debate. Having been around hardware software developments for many years and also specing and building my own computers, here’s what I think happened.
The push is to make a laptop look ultra slim and exciting. It must also be quiet. No noisy fans to break the creative flow. Nothing wrong with that but when it meets the engineering bods who say a chip with this grunt needs the following thermal consideration and the design is making it really tough, the software guys, say “OK we can put code in that makes sure it won’t get too hot and potential cause issues”. Engineers are cautious. After all when dams and bridges fail, people die. The software does exactly what was required based on cautious engineering advice. Like all design it’s the compromise between aesthetics and function. There are no mistakes here, all is intentional and the units ship.
Someone instantly discovers the software, designed to do exactly what was recommended, means the new big grunt chip computer has the same speed as last years cheaper less grunty chip unless you add active cooling (your freezer). Sales and marketing rush in and say “Make it go faster without using a freezer”. Engineering says the calculated failure and damage will go up X%. Sales say “We can handle that. After all they won’t burst into flames like the Sony laptop batteries will they???Plus, we’ve been handling keyboard problems and other design issues for years with these laptops”. Software says, “We can fix the performance problem but we can’t fix the thermal design issues which engineering have warned you about”. The engineers hate compromise so they walk out of the meeting.
Over time we shall see if the engineers were right or overly cautious. Lots of people will happily shell out for the best and never get the machines close to breaking point. Unfortunately the heavy users like DITs on set in jungle and desert conditions or on the go graphics people who are pushing deadlines are the ones most likely to encounter issues. With all hardware and software we spin the chamber and click the trigger every day. Caveat emptor.
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[Bill Davis] ““In my opinion, Apple seriously screwed up here. The testing that I did was easily within Apple’s capabilities, and it is highly irresponsible of them to ship these machines out this way. …”
THATS the type of Ready- Fire – Aim, stuff I’ve been talking about.”
AH! GOTCHA! OK…and yeah, that guy who packed it up and shipped it back immediately, and a fix came an hour later…that is a bit too much. OK, I’m picking up what you’re putting down.
[Bill Davis] “By the way, that was posted under a “handle” as are most web musings these days.”
Yeah, I hate it when people do that. Protecting their reputations behind a mask. I’m all about putting it out there and backing up what I say.
Shane
Little Frog Post
Read my blog, Little Frog in High Def -
I think Apple is still king for mobile editing. I would love some real competition here, but I’m not holding my breath.
Sure, I would prefer better-cooled laptops. Maybe not just for that 5% better render time, but especially for easier repairability and longevity. My first MacBook pro 15” died because of graphic card failure. On current pro 13” 2011 I had to change battery twice, trackpad, replaced faulty dvd drive with sdd, and charger also twice. I upgraded RAM and recently repasted a heatsink (wish I did this before). All this things are hard to do with new design. If Apple would give us 5-year warranty, let’s do it. Without it, it’s quite risky endeavour.
Miha Pece
editor -
Work with red footage, i9 helps deciding on the fly. It’s a non GPU task that the CPU does. More CPU cores and grunt, faster decode and playback/render.
Co-owner at Pollen Studio
http://www.pollenstudio.co.uk
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