Stupid System/Audio IO/Firewire Mixer Question!!

[Bob Zelin]

Willy –
if this is a picture of you, you are the cutest editor on these forums.

You have limited budget – you have to stop thinking about all these useless toys that seem “cool” to you, and get the equipment that you need to make a living. Stop it with these “cool” audio products that are way overkill for your needs.

You write –
I will be doing news packages and 30 minutes specials all on DVCpro 50.

REPLY – then your requirements are VERY SMALL, and you do not need “cool stuff”

you write –
My intentions is to gradually build a system that wi=ould allow me to edit, accelerate rendering on dvcpro 50 and eventually jumping to DVDpro HD, capture audio for VOs and show’s tags and intros.

REPLY – DVCProHD is your “ultimate goal” – this is a very modest goal that can be done very inexpensively. Keep your head on your shoulders here.

you write –
I have read and understand that the Kona 3 is my best option but now I can’t afford it…. I got to play small.. So I got a dual mpro with 6 gis of ram and 4.2 terrabytes of data…. borrowed the dvcpro deck and maudio box and was able to produce the show for now.

REPLY – there are cheaper products than the AJA Kona 3 – a lot of them. And if you have analog sources, the Kona 3 will not be the right product for you anyway. It only takes SDI in. I don’t know what your sources are, but if you have an older DVCPro VTR, you need analog component input, with analog audio inputs. This means an analog mixer, and an AJA I/O, AJA Kona LHe, Matrox MXO2 or Blackmagic Decklink HD Extreme – both better choices for you right now.

you write – I am looking at the calDigit Card for internal raid?

REPLY – you don’t need it. Use the internal drives on your MAC Pro computer. A single 1TB SATA drive will do DVCProHD all day long (at 17Mb/sec, there is no issue for a SATA drive that will do 68Mb/sec). Want a RAID – buy 2 internal drives, and use the free Apple Disk Utility to do a RAID 0 drive. When you save up some money, you can get the Cal Digit HDElement, which includes the Cal Digit RAID card, and have an external RAID 5 drive array that is excelleent. But you don’t need it right now. Save your money.

you write –
for Udio IO what should I get, does the Kona3 provides means of properly seting up the inputs for a mic I am seting up for doc. VO?

REPLY – you do not need a Kona 3. You need an card with ANALOG INPUTS. The AJA Kona LHe (with KL box), the Blackmagic Decklink HD Extreme are both excellent choices, that do both SD and HD, and have analog inputs. You use a cheap ANALOG MIXER to get your mic for VO into the analog input of these cards. The Matrox MXO2 is also a new inexpensive choice, but I have never used it. Forget the Kona 3.

you write –
don’t I need a Mixer that handles all this stuff? or it is unnecesary with a video card?

REPLY – yes, you need a mixer. A $179 Behringer Xenyx 1204FX will do just fine for you. Want to splurge – buy a Behringer Xenyx 2442FX for $299. Want to really splurge – buy a Mackie 1604VLZ for $900. Professional VTR’s (like DVCProHD VTR’s) will use EMBEDDED AUDIO. You do not need an AES mixer – the Panasonic 1200 and 1400 DVCProHD VTR’s dont even have AES inputs and outputs. They use embedded digital audio.

you write –
do this Firewire mixer the mackie or the alexis or tascam work well with fcp and SSP?
REPLY – stop it, just stop it. You need a cheap Behringer, or Mackie (or Soundcraft) analog mixer. You do not need one of these fancier mixers with firewire input – it will do NOTHING for you in this application.

you write –
which falls within my budget. or the apogee duet is a better option? which mic and card IO? for VOs
REPLY – you really have to stop this nonsense. How do you even know what an Apogee Duet is ? Are you speaking to “audio geeks” that are talking about the coolest mic preamps. YOU DO NOT NEED THIS. The analog mixers have built in mic preamps. They will work fine for a VO. If you want to go nuts, there are PLENTY of companies that sell inexpensive Mic Preamps (including Symterix, Rane, Behringer, dbx, and others) that cost a FRACTION of the price of an Apogee. This is not a game, this is a business. You DO NOT NEED an Apogee mic preamp – now stop it right now.

you write –
Now, I kind of like the idea of getting an intensity pro card and a 24′ lcd Tv for NTSC preview ? is this ok? obviosusly would now have to get it if i had a dvdpro deck but don’t have it yet? any suggestions?

REPLY – you are so anxious to spend ALL THIS MONEY on audio equipment, but not on the video I/O side – buy a Blackmagic Decklink HD Extreme for $895 and it will do everything you want, for now, and the future. Want AJA – get the Kona LHe – it will do everything you want for a little more money.

you write –
please help me determine the right path to go about?
REPLY – you want my advice. Right now, STOP listening to your “audio buddies” that are giving you rediculous advice.

bob Zelin

[Reid Caulfield]

Right. Instead, do what many video guys do: spend all your money on video & NONE or too little on audio, because, you know, audio isn’t really all that, and anyway you can always get WAY down the road, realize you have crap audio, panic & spend tons getting it fixed. I know. I fix an awful lot of it. Strike a balance. Buy modest but good gear that won’t need to be replaced in a year or when a bigger budget job comes in. And congratulations for at least talking to audio guys about your needs in advance, if that’s indeed what you’re doing.

[Willy Pimentel]

Hahaha
I love fue way hoy guys respond…
I want yo buy modest and not make big purchases before macworld and ces
That’s why I need sugestions

[Bob Zelin]

Reid does not understand that professional VTR’s use embedded audio. Purchasing expensive digital audio mixers will do nothing for you, because AES audio is NOT used in professional video editing systems. All Panasonic and Sony HD VTR’s use EMBEDDED audio – this means that the high quality audio signals are transfered along the video path (along the video cable). So you can have a vintage $250,000 SSL audio console, and it will do NOTHING FOR YOU in a professional video editing system. This applies to AVID products as well, that use embedded audio. If you work with newer camera formats, like P2 and Sony XDCam EX, these are all data files, and the audio is embedded as well.

Almost every edit suite has used a Mackie analog mixer from the BEGINNING of the non linear era, and it still applies today. Today, there are less expensive analog mixers that Mackie, but Mackie is the standard – and those that are on NLE systems are ANALOG mackie mixers that are using for MONITORING the audio, not transfering audio media across to the inputs of the NLE.

AND Reid – if this gentlemen spends $895 for a Blackmagic Decklink HD Extreme – is this “too much money ” for the video ? How much money does a Yamaha or Mackie digital audio mixer (that works via AES audio, and would be useless for this application) cost ? Is this a wiser investment in your opinion.

Since you are Mr. Audio, I guess that you know that even the biggest studios today will use a generic Pro Tools HD rig (with a 192HD Audio Interface), and simply buy an expensive hi end Mic Preamp for doing vocal work. They are not investing in API, Neve, or SSL audio mixers – that is why all of these major audio companies have FAILED.

All you need your audio mixer for is audio monitoring. Modern VTR’s use embedded SDI audio. Older VTR’s (like some older Panasonic DVCPro50 VTR’s) use analog audio on XLR audio outputs (not AES audio), so this can nicely go into an inexpensive hi quality Mackie 1402VLZ (for example), and then go into your video capture product.

bob Zelin