Shooter only pricing dispute

[Marcus Frakes]

From the looks of it he might be expecting 1/2 day rates plus travel. But it also sounds like you had to show up regardless of the weather and this must be decided if it’s something you want to charge for.

[David Roth weiss]

The real issue here is the mix of business and friendship and the inherent conflict that has created for you. Answering your question from a strictly business standpoint is fairly easy, but you have a relationship with your friend that needs to be considered first. How important is this friendship to you? Do you value the friendship, or are you willing to lose it?

Keep in mind that more relationships are destroyed over issues regarding money than anything else. A person’s value as a human being is often on the line in situations like this, making the issue not so much about the money itself, but about self-worth. This tends to place a high emotional value on the matter, making discussions difficult and creating a good likelihood for fractured feelings and thus fractured relationships.

Your friend is obviously concerned about offending and possibly losing the client. Meanwhile, you’re a professional, you acted professionally and you think you’re entitled to customary professional treatment and consideration. There’s a conflict of interest between these two points of view that probably requires compromise.

Acknowledge your friend’s POV — see if he will acknowledge your POV, and then explore all the possibilities of compromise. The best result will be that you end up with most, but not all of what you want, and that positive feelings about maintaining the friendship will override all else.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY

[Charles Lorch]

I guess what I really should have done is post this without the mention that he’s a friend. That’s obviously what makes things trickier, but on a pure business side, does weather or a change in planning affect the pricing that anyone else does? I’ve always been under the impression that so long as you’re on the gig, you should be getting paid regardless of the clients inefficiencies.

So here’s the question…
When traveling on a shoot, based on a day rate, would anyone else adjust their agreed to rates for the client do to schedule changes by the client or weather setbacks. Keeping in mind you’re on the road. And if you would adjust, then how much?

I’m looking for a strictly business baseline to then create a friend arrangement off of. In fact I thought I was doing that in taking a $1500 bill and making it $1100. Just want to be sure I’m starting from what I see as a solid industry baseline.

Thanks,

[Nick Griffin]

And THAT, boys and girls is why we’re so proud to have David as the newest host here on the business COW.

Great answer, David! Well thought out and especially well expressed.

It’s always much easier to make friends with people you do business with than it is to do business with friends. The best protection is to communicate a LOT about what each of you expects and how the deal should work. Clarify assumptions so both parties know what to expect.

[David Roth weiss]

Thanks Nick! That’s very nice of you to say…

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY

[Charles Lorch]

[David Roth Weiss] “Your friend is obviously concerned about offending and possibly losing the client.”

Actually I think he’s more concerned about his own bottom line. He is getting a flat rate for the job from his client, and based on information he gave me, a nice margin on it. But I don’t think that should affect my charges when we had a clear rate. Did we spell out that if there was weather what the rate would be, or if his client cancelled a portion what that would make the bill, no. I would base that on industry standard business practices, which is what I’m trying here to be sure I’m doing.

[David Roth weiss]

The “industry standard” as it is almost always applied here in L.A. is, you’re paid 100% of your normal rate unless there is 24-hour advanced notice of cancellation, in which case a 50% kill fee usually applies. Of course, thats based on rather age-old standards, and as Bob Dylan said, “the times they are a changin.”

In your case, if its strictly business for you, then you probably should have submitted your full invoice for $1500. Their lawyer wouldn’t give ’em an inch, why should you? That time is now lost to you and you were there for them when and where requested. Pretty simple…

The problem is, you’ve already crossed the line from strictly business to something requiring judgement and interpretation. Once you open that gate and show a willingness to compromise its pretty much open season on your time and money. Now you’re in a defensive position, and thats never fun. From this point forward the best you can do is to rely on your ability and willingness to stand up for yourself.

Let us know how this works out for you.

David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los Angeles

POST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY

[Brendan Coots]

Your “friend” is either a cheap bastard or doesn’t know what he’s doing in the slightest. You shouldn’t sweat his reaction, since he clearly stated that any reasonable fee would have blown his mind.

The only thing I would add is that it’s a very good idea to have all financials worked out PRIOR to showing up for any shoot, even if it is for a friend…

Brendan Coots
Splitvision Digital
http://www.splitvisiondigital.com

[13]

[Evolution] “Upon giving him the total he was shocked that I would charge that much since the shoot days weren’t full days. Stating that even a bill for $1000 dollars would seem high to him.”

Sure they were not full shooting days, but they were still full days away from other work you could have been doing.

You should get compensation for a FULL day if it kept you from a FULL day of payed work elsewhere.

[Ron Lindeboom]

[beenyweenies] “…have all financials worked out PRIOR to showing up for any shoot, even if it is for a friend…”

Especially if it is for a friend.

It will help you keep them that way. :o)

Ron Lindeboom