QT File or QT Reference File. Lossless?

[Chris Borjis]

whats the sequence set for?

If it’s ProRes or uncompressed then it’s lossless.

Always export as self-contained. Reference exports can
cause you major pain later.

Make sure it looks right when it’s exported.
1440×1080 is a non square pixel ratio. It plays out at 1920×1080 but
if not properly interpreted at encode time will end up looking weird.

[Vince Becquiot]

You could use Animation or PNG, or even uncompressed, 1920×1080 Square as a self contained file (Keeping the original field order). Forget the reference file for Premiere.

Vince Becquiot

Kaptis Media

Indigo Live
San Francisco – Bay Area

[Adam Berch]

Hi,

IN FCP my file is 1440 x 1080i

I just exported it out of Final Cut as a QT Reference File. It took about 10 minutes, I brought it into Premiere Pro and added my Encore Chapters. I am now Encoding it in Media Encoder as H.264 Blu-Ray, 1440 x 1080 29.97 Upper. PCM Audio 48 KHZ, VBR 2 Pass, Target Bit Rate 18.5, Max Bit Rate 20.

This is going to be used just for this purpose, PPro, to Media Encoder, to Encore to be burned as a Blu-Ray.

Once I have Burned 2 or 3 copies of the Blu-Ray Disc, I am deleting everything off my hard drive. It will not be used again for anything else.

If it does not look good or it looks weird after it Encodes or when the Disc is finished, I will make a Self contained QT file out of FCP and use different settings.

Thanks for the info and help

[John Heagy]

[Chris Borjis] “Reference exports can
cause you major pain later.”

Only if one doesn’t understand them.

It’s a powerful tool that can speed exports and save space.

It sounds like the ref movie worked. A self contained will be no better.

John

[Walter Soyka]

[John Heagy] “It sounds like the ref movie worked. A self contained will be no better.”

In this case, with 8-bit HDV footage, I agree.

However, I think that QuickTime reference movies are 8-bit, so 10-bit material (or higher) in a reference movie would be truncated by QuickTime’s decoder as it was passed to Premiere.

Again, not an issue in this case — just pointing out that reference movies may not be literally lossless in all cases, and that deeper-depth workflows should test.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events

[John Heagy]

[Walter Soyka] “However, I think that QuickTime reference movies are 8-bit, so 10-bit material (or higher) in a reference movie would be truncated by QuickTime’s decoder as it was passed to Premiere.”

Most all our ProRes recordings, and FCP7 exports, are done using ref.mov and I can assure you they all retain their 10bit goodness. Reference movie exports are “lossless” but it really doesn’t make sense to think of it that way. It’s more like a an alias/link tho changes can be made in the wrapper that affect scale.

We use ref.mov extensively. It’s an advanced concept for advanced workflows and needs a solid shared environment to really take advantage of it… and we do.

No Adobe product has ever exported ref.mov so I don’t expect it ever in Premiere. A real shame really.

Avid still supports it.

John

[John Heagy]

[Vince Becquiot] “You could use Animation or PNG, or even uncompressed,”

Uncompressed yes… animation or PNG no, because that would force a YUV to RGB color space conversion.

John

[Walter Soyka]

[John Heagy] “Most all our ProRes recordings, and FCP7 exports, are done using ref.mov and I can assure you they all retain their 10bit goodness. Reference movie exports are “lossless” but it really doesn’t make sense to think of it that way. It’s more like a an alias/link tho changes can be made in the wrapper that affect scale.”

Forgive me, John. I stand corrected.

My problem here was specifically related to reference movies referring to image sequences — and in this case, depth is lost. I certainly defer to your experience with ProRes.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events

[John Heagy]

No worries.

I’m a soldier in what seems to be a loosing battle to keep ref.mov supported. I’m quick to defend or correct the many misconceptions that plaque it.

Seems ref.mov may be heading down the same road as manual transmissions are in cars.

It’s something Apple has deemed too difficult to use and therefore must be purged despite it’s usefulness to people who do understand and benefit from it.

Next apple will remove or hide Terminal the way they did ~/Library

John

[Walter Soyka]

[John Heagy] “I’m a soldier in what seems to be a loosing battle to keep ref.mov supported.”

I used them all the time when I was on an all-Apple workflow. If reference movies suits your workflow, I certainly understand why you’d fight for them!

Now as I rely on tools from a broader ecosystem, I find not just reference movies, but QuickTime as a whole to be quite a bit less appealing. Broader support would have gone a long way, but now I’m pining for a more open standard.

[John Heagy] “Seems ref.mov may be heading down the same road as manual transmissions are in cars.”

I drive a manual, but I like to ironically refer to it as a “standard.”

[John Heagy] “It’s something Apple has deemed too difficult to use and therefore must be purged despite it’s usefulness to people who do understand and benefit from it.”

I don’t know what their motivation was, but I agree with you that it was a genius feature in QuickTime, and I’m sad to see it left out of AVFoundation.

Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events