Please help with export to tape on decklink hd extreme: RS422 deck control not frame accurate

[Alejandro Maldonado]

Ok, so a friend of mine game me a theory about the problem I have, I

[Trevor Kinsey]

You can probably loop the Y signal at the deck end. Most SP decks have loop through inputs. Just make sure you only terminate it at the end.

Trevor Kinsey,
Technical Producer,
CVP Film and Television,
Melbourne,
Australia

[Felix Dames]

Hi,

I have the same Problem when do “Export to tape”

with BMD DecklinkPro Driver5.4.2 PremierePro 2.0

All our studio equipment is synced with blackburst generator
of course the decklink card too!

When capturing in PremierePro 2.0 everything is absolute frame accurate!
Premiere Preferences -> Device Control:
Preroll: 5sec
Timecode Offset: 0 frames
Premiere Preferences -> Device Control -> Options:
Protocol: Sony RS-422
Port: Com3
Use VTRs internal Cue: [Off]
Time Source: LTC ( for me it’s not possible to switch to LTC+VITC as told in the BMD manual. After pressing ok for LTC+VITC it’s always switched back to LTC!)
Timebase: 25fps (I work in PAL)

But when I “Export to Tape” it’s not always frame accurate!!!
I only do INSERT edits with nicely prerecorded timecode + black signal on Tape.
The IN point on tape (after recording) is always accurate but the OUT point slides about 1-3 frames! most of the time only 1 frame but sometimes 3 frames! and sometimes absolute frame accurate with exactly the same export settings!!!
Or the OUT point on tape is accurate but the edits in my timeline are not at the same position on tape! Slides about 1-3frames !
My “video hard drive” is an SCSI320 Raid 0 and it is not fragmented! And it’s fast enough to do 125 fps in SD mode PAL!

My Export to Tape Settings in PremierePro2.0:
Current Protocol: Sony RS-422
-> Options:
Sync Record: [Off] (I can’t enable it – after pressing ok it switchs back to [off])
Delay movie start: 5 frames
Manual edit timing: 5 frames
Preroll: 5 seconds
Hard record frame control: Non Drop-Frame

These Setting work for me SOMETIMES (other settings mess up everything and I tried every combination) but I have to do the same edit (export to tape) up to 5-10 time to get it frame accurate and that is horrible when your client needs a master playout which has to be frame accurate! and I always have to run to our equipment room to check back on the digital BetaCAM machine if it’s frame accurate or not and than run back and do the edit again and again… till it’s frame accurate 🙁

I took the time to write down all this because this problem is not new to BMD and I want this bug to be fixed! And I want to bring light to this really dark corner!
I work with decklinkPro now for 1 1/2 years and I tried nearly every new driver since driver v4.7.5 -> 5.4.2 with PremierePro 1.5 and 2.0 and I always have this “Export to Tape” problem! The only time it was ALWAYS frame accurate was with PremierePro1.5 and Driver v5.1.1!
As I started working with BMD DecklinkPro I thought “OK the windows drivers are new and they will work in the future… and they worked with v5.1.1” and now the problem comes up again! This drives my mad because I can’t trust on BMD – I always have to check the frame accuracy after every driver update and that’s why I’m still on driver v5.4.2 and not on driver v5.6 because I have to work with this card and not beta testing! I do not have the time to check that everything is working ok it’s BMD job but it seems that they do their job not very well and that’s why I can’t trust on them!

So dear BMD team you created nice video hardware for a fair price but you failed to write good drivers to trust on.

I like your card and want to work with it in the future so give yourself a “slap” and make the “Export to Tape” frame accurate and I mean ALWAYS frame accurate!
On your website you say how professional your products are but professional is frame accurate!

And by the way in the past I posted this problem 2 times to BMD Support and 2 times to Creative Cow. Now I’m doing it again and hope it is the last time.

So to all other users who have this problem (or not): take the time and write down your settings which work or explain your problem with “export to tape”.

I’m wondering: out there are just some few people having this problem? or do they haven’t noticed it yet?!?

best regards,

Felix Dames

[Felix Dames]

With these “Export to Tape” Settings in PremierePro2.0 and a digitalBetaCAM
recorder all equipment synced with bi-level blackburstgenerator:

Current Protocol: Sony RS-422
-> Options:
Sync Record: [Off] (I can’t enable it – after pressing ok it switchs back to [off]) WHY???
Delay movie start: 5 frames
Manual edit timing: 5 frames
Preroll: 5 seconds
Hard record frame control: Non Drop-Frame

and the driver 5.6 it’s now frame accurate!

I did the test with diffrent videomaterial and 5 times in a row with same settings and with the same result!

Frame accurate! Thanks!

Now it seems that I can trust on….

Felix

[Hans Mester]

Hello all,

I am looking for somebody who is using a Decklink card together with a Betacam SP/PAL and what software is used.

I would like to know if it is possible to do frame-accurate inserts (+/- 0 frames, 100% accurate)

Right now, I am using a different editing software/hardware and it turned out that it cannot insert onto tape (although I have been told otherwise in the beginning). So, I am very careful before I look at a new solution.

I have also seen that there have been similar insert problems with the decklink cards. Have these issues been resolved by new drivers?

Any information would be very helpful.

Thanks
s61

H.m.

[Trevor Kinsey]

We have two dual G5 MACs running Final Cut Pro 5.0.4 with Decklink Extreme cards and have no trouble with insert and assemble editing, always frame accurate on our PVW2800P deck. We use an external sync generator.

We had a Cinewave card prior to getting our first Decklink and gave up on it after a few more months and bought the second Decklink. The Decklink does everything we expect of it. The only issue we have is that because the card pegs everything to broadcast safe levels there is sometimes a video level change (brightness) when we insert into a pre recorded tape from a less reliable source.

There are no problems when inserting into material already recorded from an edit suite.

Trevor

Trevor Kinsey,
Technical Producer,
CVP Film and Television,
Melbourne,
Australia

[Hans Mester]

Hi,
Australia is NTSC, though. I was wondering if Alejandro_m1 has managed to get his problem to work.

Thanks

H.m.

[Trevor Kinsey]

Actually Australia is PAL. A rule of thumb, those countries heavily influenced by European countries (including England) in the previous century use 50Hz mains and PAL or SECAM, those influenced by the USA use 60Hz mains and NTSC.

Trevor Kinsey,
Technical Producer,
CVP Film and Television,
Melbourne,
Australia

[Hans Mester]

Ooops!

I guess I thought Australia is closer to the US than to Europe, but then again
so did Columbus (or something similar 🙂 )

thanks anyway!

H.m.

[Trevor Kinsey]

Our Prime Minister certainly seems to think that our interest lie close to George Bush, and the country is probably closer to the US too, but we come from good English convict stock.

Trevor Kinsey,
Technical Producer,
CVP Film and Television,
Melbourne,
Australia