online editing with dvcprohd question

[Chris Bell]

You are essentially editing in on-line quality with the DVCPRO HD codec. Your G5 mac is more than capable of handling the job. (I’ve cut shows on a G4 powerbook). Unless you are already set up for uncompressed editing, it’s probably not worth the trouble and expense. I don’t think you would gain much.

Cut your show, and print back via firewire to DVCPRO HD tape for your master.

Chris Bell

[Shane Ross]

[Bruce Lapointe] “1. If I want to online myself, what equipment must I invest in to do so (or do I have enough already?) (I am working on apple G5, dual 2.0 ghz, 3.5 gigs of ram, ATI Radeon 9600 card, SATA enclosure with 4×500 gig drives, Matrox HD monitoring system)?”

This is the exact machine that I have (Dual 2, 3.5GB RAM), and I have been editing DVCPRO HD 720p24 and 720p60 for 3 years, and still do on the same machine with ZERO issues. Originally I used G-Raid FW800 drives, but now I use CalDigit S2VR Duos. Firewire 800 is fine, eSATA is better. If you captured at DVCPRO HD resolution, then you are at full quality. All you need now is an HD capture card and HD color correction monitor. The MXO and Apple 23″ display will be the cheapest way to accomplish this. I have a Kona LH and an HD CRT…but HD CRTs are rare. And the other HD LCD options start at $4000. This is if you are color correcting yourself.

Now..output. What will you be outputting to? This will really determine what card you need.

[Bruce Lapointe] “then re-digitize relevant clips via component cables to card but at what settings?”

NO recapturing needed. You are already at the best quality you can get.

[Bruce Lapointe] “I have heard rumors that one can online dvcpro hd without high end capture cards and raids.”

Capture and edit…yes. Output to DVCPRO HD tape, and color correct by routing thru the 1200 or 1400 deck to an HD monitor, thus negating the need for a card….yes. But the Deck is $25,000. The cards are between $995 and $2500. Renting the deck is $350-$500 a day. Get a card. And you will still need a monitor.

[Bruce Lapointe] “2. Is there a major difference in pic quality and file size between dvcpro hd footage captured via firewire with dvcpro hd codec and same footage captured uncompressed?”

The only difference would be that the uncompressed footage has a far larger data rate, requires really fast RAIDS to manage, and takes up 10 times more space. Stick with DVCPRO HD. Walter Biscardi and I capture, edit and color correct this format all the time. We then output to HDCAM or D5 via a Kona 3. DVCPRO HD is a great codec to work in.

Shane

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[Bruce Lapointe]

Thanks for the clear and concise help, guys! Extremely helpful.I especially appreciate it since I can’t seem to find these answers anywhere else.

I have a couple of remaining questions:

A) I do have the Matrox MXO system and a 2nd 23 inch apple display for hd monitoring. Are you saying I need to upgrade my video card (to say Kona or AJA) in order to color correct DVCPRO HD footage with the matrox? Is this why I can see color correct still frames that I am making in FCP in my second 23 inch apple display via Matrox but when I try to play any DVCPR HD clip, it stops after one second with dropped frames every time?

– If I need to invest in hd card and want to use it in future for uncomp hd onlining, which cards would you suggest?

B) Does ProRes codec offer any quality benefits over dvcpro hd codec?

C) Which video playback setting should I be using for monitoring via Matrox MXO? (original footage was DVCPRO HD, 720P, 24 and automatically converted to 59.94 in FCP). This project is for TV broadcast (color correcting in YUV or RGB?)

D) My clip properties in the FCP browser for DVCPRO HD Footage read – COMPRESSOR = dvcpro hd 720p 60 / DATA RATE = 13.9 mb/sec. Is this correct?

E) I am using HDV footage in the same timeline as DVCPRO HD. Do I need to do anything to this HDV footage (ie. uprez is somehow using media manager)?

Thanks so much.

Bruce.

[Shane Ross]

[Bruce Lapointe] “A) I do have the Matrox MXO system and a 2nd 23 inch apple display for hd monitoring. Are you saying I need to upgrade my video card (to say Kona or AJA) in order to color correct DVCPRO HD footage with the matrox?”

No. That would be perfect for color correcting DVCPRO HD. I was saying that it was an output only card…it cannot capture. But I use it on occasion and love it. Perfect for all the footage you capture via firewire or import from tapeless acquisition.

[Bruce Lapointe] “Is this why I can see color correct still frames that I am making in FCP in my second 23 inch apple display via Matrox but when I try to play any DVCPR HD clip, it stops after one second with dropped frames every time?”

NO, that would indicate another problem somewhere else. What machine are you using? How much RAM? What Graphics Card?

[Bruce Lapointe] “- If I need to invest in hd card and want to use it in future for uncomp hd onlining, which cards would you suggest?”

The MXO is fine. A better HD monitor might be in order. JVC HD LCD, or TVLogic if you can afford it. They have HD SDI connections and the MXO can output that. And the AJA and Black-Magic solutions are fine too. But you have a good solution now. NO need to invest unless you need to capture video. And then, it depends what your capture needs are.

[Bruce Lapointe] “C) Which video playback setting should I be using for monitoring via Matrox MXO? (original footage was DVCPRO HD, 720P, 24 and automatically converted to 59.94 in FCP). This project is for TV broadcast (color correcting in YUV or RGB?)”

MXO DVCPRO HD 760p 59.94 8-bit.

[Bruce Lapointe] “B) Does ProRes codec offer any quality benefits over dvcpro hd codec?”

Not much. Larger file sizes. It does get you into a 10-bit color space for color correction, but I have had no problems color correcting and delivering DVCPRO HD. Never had a need to go to ProRes.

[Bruce Lapointe] “D) My clip properties in the FCP browser for DVCPRO HD Footage read – COMPRESSOR = dvcpro hd 720p 60 / DATA RATE = 13.9 mb/sec. Is this correct?”

Yes.

[Bruce Lapointe] “E) I am using HDV footage in the same timeline as DVCPRO HD. Do I need to do anything to this HDV footage (ie. uprez is somehow using media manager)?”

Just render it as DVCPRO HD. Unless you are dealing with differing frame rates. Then you need to use Compressor to convert it to DVCPRO HD and the correct frame rate.

Shane

Littlefrog Post

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[Bruce Lapointe]

[Bruce Lapointe] “Is this why I can see color correct still frames that I am making in FCP in my second 23 inch apple display via Matrox but when I try to play any DVCPR HD clip, it stops after one second with dropped frames every time?”

Shane – NO, that would indicate another problem somewhere else. What machine are you using? How much RAM? What Graphics Card?

NEW – I am using dual 2.0ghz, G5, 3.5 gigs of ram, ATI Radeon 9600 pro card. I have tried different options in FCP to alleviate but still get dropped frames every time.

[Bruce Lapointe] “C) Which video playback setting should I be using for monitoring via Matrox MXO? (original footage was DVCPRO HD, 720P, 24 and automatically converted to 59.94 in FCP). This project is for TV broadcast (color correcting in YUV or RGB?)”

Shane – MXO DVCPRO HD 760p 59.94 8-bit.

NEW – Amongst the many options available I have in FCP, I have tried DVCPRO HD 720P 59.94 and same at 29.97 and both at RGB and YUV color space (I dont get a choice of bits in the pulldown menu). The matrox displays totally distorted, weird colors, tiny image, lines, etc at 59.94 but totally fine at 29.97.