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One year later…
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Interesting. It would seem for you the issue is lack of roadmap. It seems Apple is beginning to change in that regard. This has been the case since they posted that they were working on multicam and broadcast monitoring. Now they’re talking about MXF support. Of course for facility who need shared simultaneous project (event) access, no word on that. There’s certainly no word on new systems. Apple does have a business model and they do it to benefit their business, not ours. I can live with that as long as there products benefit my business. It kills me too wondering if/what will replace the MacPro.
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I’d add that the approach a new facility makes vs a well established facility makes may be very different. Today someone may consider starting with just a few FCPX seats, iMacs, DaVinci, ProTools and find a much lower point of entry. I think as the broader “middle” moves up the ladder they will overtake the older facilities. FCPX will continue to develop the features as those facilities grow.
On the other hand, established facilities have work flows they can’t (nor shouldn’t) break from and FCPX is missing key elements for them and waiting and guessing just isn’t a good business decision for them.
Even RadicalMedia had to wait until FCPX got to a point it could meet his current facility needs. For some facilities waiting was not a good financial option. It’s interesting to show how Evan and Mark, seeing the same product, made different decisions. It’s not about right or wrong, the business models for the facilities are probably different. The workflows they needed supported are probably different.
Given SCRI numbers, Apple in all likelihood made sound decisions based on their own business model. I expect FCPX’s growth pattern will be primarily in new facilities. As the industry changes, FCPX will, at least, be one of the leaders (IMHO). I don’t see this much different that FCP legacy actually.
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[Chris Harlan] “You keep referring to “forums like this” as if this is the only place that has anything negative to say about X. I don’t know what its like in NYC, but here in LA that is far from reality. “
The level of negativity in this forum is not something I’ve ever encountered in real-world interactions. Most of what I see in the real world is cautious interest or at worst skepticism, not hostility.
[Chris Harlan] “And “really choose something else?” “Migrate away?” FCP X is something else. The only thing it has in common with FCP 7 are the words “Final Cut Pro.” Using other companies’ software is actually a closer experience to using FCP 7, than using X. How is choosing X not choosing something else? How is going with it NOT migrating away from FCP 7.”
FCP X is something new, yes. My point was that some people seemed to be predicting, 12 months ago, that there would be some mass exodus from FCP 7 starting immediately, such that any work Apple did to make FCP X suitable for higher-end users would come too late, as those users would already be on Avid or Premiere. This does not appear to have occurred. Apple has now added most of the critical missing features to FCP X, and consequently FCP X, while not the automatic choice for people moving off of FCP 7 (because it is, after all, a totally different app) will at least be in the running. (For anyone who isn’t actively hostile, at least — which I don’t think most people, once you move beyond those fanning the Internet firestorm, actually are.)
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Digital Workflow/Colorist, Nice Dissolve.You should follow me on Twitter here. Or read our blog.
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Personally, I think building a facility around Avid products to be a bit risky at this point. I just don’t see them making any moves that will pull them back from their decline. Of course NLE software is cheap and that they are no longer proprietary in much of their lower cost hardware means a future switch wouldn’t be too difficult or expensive.
I’d be concerned about their more expensive hardware though. Ironically that’s most important to their revenue and profits. One of three things, I suspect, will have to happen, they either change their business model, they’re sold, they fold. Folding isn’t immediate because their debt situation isn’t bad. The question is what is dropped given the first two possibilities. That question, IMHO, should gnaw at the decision makers as much as any Apple makes. To me the key difference is, I suspect, It would be much easier to move from Apple (and some have done that) than to move from Avid if one is invested in their more expensive hardware.
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[Craig Seeman] “I’d add that the approach a new facility makes vs a well established facility makes may be very different. Today someone may consider starting with just a few FCPX seats, iMacs, DaVinci, ProTools and find a much lower point of entry. “
This.
If I were building a new facility today for in-house create editorial (i.e. not suites rented to outside editors, where you have just offer what they want), the ‘standard’ editing machine would absolutely be iMac + Thunderbolt RAID & video I/O + FCP X.
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Digital Workflow/Colorist, Nice Dissolve.You should follow me on Twitter here. Or read our blog.
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[Craig Seeman] “Even RadicalMedia had to wait until FCPX got to a point it could meet his current facility needs.”
… and they are still kind of waiting. FCP7 is still in their pipeline.
Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events -
[Chris Kenny] “If I were building a new facility today for in-house create editorial (i.e. not suites rented to outside editors, where you have just offer what they want), the ‘standard’ editing machine would absolutely be iMac + Thunderbolt RAID & video I/O + FCP X.”
Totally reasonable, but just one solution among many to one challenge among many.
With lower costs and more open hardware, I’m not seeing a need to choose sides. Put all the tools in your toolbox, and use the best one for the job at hand.
Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events -
[Chris Kenny] “[Chris Harlan] “You keep referring to “forums like this” as if this is the only place that has anything negative to say about X. I don’t know what its like in NYC, but here in LA that is far from reality. ”
The level of negativity in this forum is not something I’ve ever encountered in real-world interactions. Most of what I see in the real world is cautious interest or at worst skepticism, not hostility.”
Really? I believe you, but that hasn’t been my experience at all. I find mention of it is usually met with a shudder, and then some sort of unbelieving, exasperated shake of the head. I find myself in the odd position, from time to time, of being an X defender. A lot of that is do to my experience on this forum. I understand how you might feel from your experiences here, last summer, but I believe this forum has developed a sense of objectivity that you are not giving it credit for. In your absence, we’ve also had quite a few deep, interesting discussions about structure in ways that I’ve found in few other places.
[Chris Kenny] “My point was that some people seemed to be predicting, 12 months ago, that there would be some mass exodus from FCP 7 starting immediately, such that any work Apple did to make FCP X suitable for higher-end users would come too late, as those users would already be on Avid or Premiere.”
I’m sure that some people were somewhere, but I think the general opinion on this forum from very early on was that FCP 7 had at least 1-3 years life in it. I know that I expressed that early and often. I know a number of fellow posters did as well. Personally, I can’t remember a single post where-in anyone was predicting an immediate mass exodus from FCP 7. Frankly, I can’t imagine anyone that uses/used FCP7 in business making such a silly claim.
[Chris Kenny] “Apple has now added most of the critical missing features to FCP X, and consequently FCP X, while not the automatic choice for people moving off of FCP 7 (because it is, after all, a totally different app) will at least be in the running. “
I agree, especially now that it seems to be more stable. For a number of people, it is a good choice. Currently, it doesn’t have adequate features for me to use it as anything other than an ancillary program. And, I don’t know that it ever will. I work in a relatively specialized world, and I don’t really believe that Apple is marching in my direction. They no longer have the incentive to do so. Luckily, other companies do. And, I’m okay with all of that.
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[Walter Soyka] “With lower costs and more open hardware, I’m not seeing a need to choose sides. Put all the tools in your toolbox, and use the best one for the job at hand.”
Hear, hear!
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[Walter Soyka] “Put all the tools in your toolbox, and use the best one for the job at hand.”
I mean no disrespect when I say this, but I can’t see this happening.
The “buy them all and use them all” approach is unsustainable, not from a cost standpoint today, but from an management and data archive standpoint, and let’s not forget the sanity standpoint as it’s rather important.
This means that whatever system you go with, you will “forever” have to buy that system if your legacy projects mean anything to you. I understand that it’s not “one app fits all”, but to have potentially four NLEs and manage all of that for the next 5-10 years seems a bit nutty. Let alone the fact that you will have to stay current on 4 different NLEs.
Right now, there’s a lot of parity in the NLE world between hardware, keyboard shortcut modifiers, and interchange languages (thanks in part to XML, and Quicktime, yikes). What if those world diverge? What if Avid’s next move is to start over?
What if two years from you decide MC isn’t the right way? Or PPro or FCPX?
This means that in two and a half years when the client calls about the project from two years ago, you will have to buy one of these applications just to maintain the archive. Seems like it’s too much, or maybe I’m just a peon and it’s just too much for me. My decision isn’t going to be based on a filter set/tape transport alone. I still can’t find an answer if Smoke 2013 has interchange out beyond OMF. Does it?
At least FCP7 left XML in it’s wake and I will most likely be able to boot an old disk image on a future mac.
There’s one thing I have learned “one year later” and that’s make sure that your project can be saved in some other format than the proprietary .WhateverCompany project file. And it’s yet another reason why we haven’t moved much.
Jeremy
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